HP Prime or HP 50g

[Hlib]

(11-26-2015 08:50 PM)RyanB Wrote:  It dawned on me yesterday: I wish I could have the HP50g operating system in the HP Prime chassis. Calculator heaven?

-Ryan

Bought a second HP-50G (not Prime). Heaven in the real world :-)

[Neve]

I had the Prime for a couple of weeks before returning it.
Compared to a real (legacy RPN or RPL) HP calculator, it’s a piece of crap despite the color screen and the much faster processor.
Had it been a real RPN calc like the 50g or any previous real HP calc, il would have been great.
I personally hate it.
I’m still using both my HP41’s at home and at work for everything.
The best scientific calc HP has ever made, with the hp50g.
The Prime is a total disgrace to HP calculators.

This is my personal opinion.

[pier4r]

I'm just started to program with the hp prime app on android (after having boight it in may 2017). I see that hppl is Pascal like but, maybe I am wrong , the available library of commands (especially related to programming)) seems a fraction of the size of those available for the hp 50g.

I also quickly went through hpcalc and the general software library and I did not spot any library made to simplify some programming procedures (like on lists). I saw a lot of math functions though and that's neat.

Even the manual is quite short (I found no AUR)

So the levels reached by the 50g are really high I would say. Or I am just plain wrong so would be nice if someone would give me some good directions (do other forums on the prime exists that are as active as this one?)

[Arno K]

I now own both, the Prime for graphics and most CAS tasks, the 50g for some programs, I like squeezing the last byte out, these: get it running with smallest size is fun, and that is what I have those calcs for. A hybrid is what I would like to have, the elegance of the Prime with touch screen, size and keyboard and a fully implemented RPN .
Arno

[Neve]

(09-17-2017 08:53 AM)Arno K Wrote:  I now own both, the Prime for graphics and most CAS tasks, the 50g for some programs, I like squeezing the last byte out, these: get it running with smallest size is fun, and that is what I have those calcs for. A hybrid is what I would like to have, the elegance of the Prime with touch screen, size and keyboard and a fully implemented RPN .
Arno

Yes, the Prime would be a very good calc if it had a different firmware. Full RPN/RPL.
Connections to the outside world is also another issue, though... unfortunately...
Maybe some day someone will write a new firmware like the NewRPL on the HP50g.

[pier4r]

As far as I know, Claudio said that porting newRPL to the Prime won't be that hard.

he focus firsts on the 50g, because the 50g is still going strong although discontinued.

So, nothing bad. Moreover for programming I won't consider HPPL bad, it is more readable than RPL.

[Neve]

(09-17-2017 10:02 AM)pier4r Wrote:  As far as I know, Claudio said that porting newRPL to the Prime won't be that hard.

he focus firsts on the 50g, because the 50g is still going strong although discontinued.

So, nothing bad. Moreover for programming I won't consider HPPL bad, it is more readable than RPL.

That’s good new!
Everything that is not 100% RPN compliant is not to my liking and I consider it a step back in evolution.

But I hear you.

[BigEvilBarry]

I would like to buy SwissMicros, but DM15L (I am assuming you are getting the full-size model) costs the same, and (just like a real 15C vs. 11C) offers more memory and more capabilities and you don't lose anything.

Never regretted this decision.

[zeno333]

As a side note, the Swiss Micros DM42 is the most capable "key stroke programmable" calculator ever made...

[MagicMachine2]

Hi guys

I just bought my HP Prime 2 days after yearning for it (or its predecessors eg. HP 50g, HP 49g, etc) like more than a decade ago - since 2004/05 to be more precise

This is the first HP calculator I have ever owned. Had been using Casio calculators since teenage years.

Glad to able to register & join this forum. Looking forward to learn a great deal about my new "toy" from all of you.

Thank you.

[Michael de Estrada]

I think the Prime has the advantage in programming clarity with CAS PPL instead of RPL on the 50g in situations where you are generating symbolic structures like matrix elements. For example, below are portions of programs in RPL and PPL on my 50g and Prime:

RPL

“row1” << IF K1 0 >= THEN L3 NEG PUTI K1 PUTI L3 PUTI K1 PUTI ELSE 0 PUTI 1 PUTI 0 PUTI 1 PUTI END >>

PPL

IF A >= 0 THEN CAS(“row1:=[x^3,-A,-x^3,-A]”);
ELSE CAS(“row1:=[0,-1,0,-1]”);
END;

It is immediately apparent what is going on in the PPL code, whereas the RPL code is a bit obtuse.

[grsbanks]

(04-07-2018 02:55 AM)Michael de Estrada Wrote:  It is immediately apparent what in going on in the PPL code, whereas the RPL code is a bit obtuse.

For someone who has no experience in either RPL or HP-PPL, I would agree. Whatever you do have experience in is always easier to grok. For my part, it's the RPL version.

[JDW]

The biggest difference to me, as a 50g owner, is the lack of libraries on the Prime. I especially have my eye on EE libraries.

The 50g has this:
http://www.software49g.gmxhome.de

The only thing I could find for the Prime is this "demo of things to come":
https://www.hpcalc.org/details/7737

Specifically it says, "This will be more comprehensive once complex number support is added to the HP Prime solver, but for now it is just a demo of what is to come."

Could someone "in the know" please explain to me what is meant by "more comprehensive complex number support" on the Prime? I thought the Prime supported complex numbers already.

Thanks.

[Thomas Radtke]

(01-30-2015 01:37 PM)Claudio L. Wrote:  

(01-30-2015 08:07 AM)Thomas Radtke Wrote:  To bad RPL will die with the 50g. Should get some while they're still on sale.

It doesn't *have* to die, we just have to make an open source replacement (sorry for the ad):

newRPL project Home page

I only wish this was a community effort, not just a one-man attempt to save RPL.

Claudio

Now we have collector prices for the only target of NewRPL. While I was waiting for a fire sale of the 50g like we have seen it in the USA, the price was kept high and then went through the roof. It is actually the end IMO.

[Neve]

(07-10-2018 04:47 PM)Thomas Radtke Wrote:  

(01-30-2015 01:37 PM)Claudio L. Wrote:  It doesn't *have* to die, we just have to make an open source replacement (sorry for the ad):

newRPL project Home page

I only wish this was a community effort, not just a one-man attempt to save RPL.

Claudio

Now we have collector prices for the only target of NewRPL. While I was waiting for a fire sale of the 50g like we have seen it in the USA, the price was kept high and then went through the roof. It is actually the end IMO.

Agreed 100%. Cause honestly the Prime and the direction HP has been going is pure crap. Nothing like the real HP calculators like the venerable 41C among others.

[Claudio L.]

(07-10-2018 04:47 PM)Thomas Radtke Wrote:  

(01-30-2015 01:37 PM)Claudio L. Wrote:  It doesn't *have* to die, we just have to make an open source replacement (sorry for the ad):

newRPL project Home page

I only wish this was a community effort, not just a one-man attempt to save RPL.

Claudio

Now we have collector prices for the only target of NewRPL. While I was waiting for a fire sale of the 50g like we have seen it in the USA, the price was kept high and then went through the roof. It is actually the end IMO.

That post was from 2015, and isn't quite correct anymore: newRPL has the 50g, 39gs and 40gs as targets, which are at a much lower price point (with limitations, I'll give you that). The Prime version will come (eventually), but the way I see it is nobody will ever substitute the Prime original firmware because it's really good. The only solution is to have both operating systems on-calc and switch between them (by turning the calc off and back on with a special set of key presses).
Actually I should not say "both" but "all of them", since there's now the Numworks OS as well as a candidate. It isn't as far-fetched as many would think, I've been doing some work in that area but there's nothing to show yet, and with my current work load I'd say don't expect it for Christmas either, but it will happen.

[JDW]

Since no one took time to answer the question but fourth in my previous post, I will assume that none of you know very much about complex numbers on the Prime or about EE libraries. Unfortunate, but oh well...

Perhaps one of you will be able to answer this question though. By reading through this thread and others, I see people who seem to be at least semi-educated who boldly call the Prime “crap,“ while others give it high praise. Can someone please explain this?

[Neve]

(07-10-2018 09:24 PM)JDW Wrote:  Since no one took time to answer the question but fourth in my previous post, I will assume that none of you know very much about complex numbers on the Prime or about EE libraries. Unfortunate, but oh well...

Perhaps one of you will be able to answer this question though. By reading through this thread and others, I see people who seem to be at least semi-educated who boldly call the Prime “crap,“ while others give it high praise. Can someone please explain this?

The Prime is mainly intended for high school and maybe for some college people who don’t want to take the time to learn the awesome benefits of a true RPN machine like the older, albeit less powerful and slower calculators. Up to the 50g, which I also own and like very much, HP made great all RPN calculators which fit the needs of anyone.
My HP41CX got me through college and well beyond. And is still in use everyday.
The Prime is a calculator which, in my opinion, is not even near up to par with it’s predecessors. Had HP made the Prime a more powerful 50g, or even a more powerful 41C, that would have been awesome, and I would not have returned mine the next day I bought it.
Except for the raw power and the colors, it has nothing I need. Although my new 41CL provides all I would ever need.

PS: I’m not trying to start a war here. It’s just my opinion.

[JDW]

Thank you for your opinion. My first HP was the 28S purchased in 1989 when I started engineering school. I used it throughout college and in my professional life for years, until some of the keys would occasionally fail (still work but only if I press on them REALLY HARD). I then bought a 48GX, and added an FRAM card with Meta Kernel, and I continue to use that at the office. I also purchased a 50g for home use. I love RPN and would not use any HP in algebraic mode, nor would I purchase a purely algebraic calculator for myself.

With that said, you're previous post described the Prime not merely as "crap" but as "pure crap," which in my book is defined as "100% crap" or "100% worthless." For truly, what use do you have of 100% crap except for fertilizing your garden? Sorry, but I am a straight shooter with the English language and so I cannot help but be bewildered by emotionally-charged and somewhat meaningless terms like "crap" (whether it be pure, 50%, or crap with less fat).

Cutting to the chase, what I like and want is not always what is most appropriate for my children, one of whom is in Jr. High and the other in 10th grade. Their school STRONG RECOMMENDS the ancient TI-83 Plus, which I am not inclined to buy for them, but I do see it on the College Board list of approved calculators, along with the 50g and Prime. My children are less nerdy that I am and my thinking is that a calculator that is not only College Board approved but also offers CAS (which again is College Board approved) might be a good choice for them, even if the calculator is used by them mostly in Algebraic mode. In other words, "Algebraic mode" is not a curse word to me, even though I have great experience and love for RPN. I am open-minded.

I've actually showed my children the 50g and offered to allow them to use it, but they haven't warmed up to it like I have, even when I put it in algebraic mode. No surprises since most high schoolers really don't like math in the first place! Funny, but I didn't either, which makes it all the more curious I chose to be an EE! (I like a challenge.) But the fact remains that I got my first "real" calculator in college, not high school.

And so, I am mulling the Prime for my kids. And hey, that would give me a change to toy with it too (a real machine, as opposed to an simulated calc on my computer screen, which I have used). My kids seem interested in either the TI-84 Plus CE or the Prime, but most likely because they are the iOS generation whose eyes quickly get transfixed on devices with color screens. But clearly the Prime will win this fight because it has a touch-screen too!

I just am personally curious about why there are no useful libraries for the Prime like for the 50g and earlier calcs. (And please don't tell me, "It's because the Prime is crap." Please!) To repeat my earlier post, which thus far not a single person has dared to comment directly upon...

The 50g has this:
http://www.software49g.gmxhome.de

Yet the only similar library I could find for the Prime is this "demo of things to come":
https://www.hpcalc.org/details/7737

Specifically it says, "This will be more comprehensive once complex number support is added to the HP Prime solver, but for now it is just a demo of what is to come."

Could someone "in the know" please explain to me what is meant by "more comprehensive complex number support" on the Prime? I thought the Prime supported complex numbers already.

Thank you.

[Joe Horn]

(07-11-2018 12:17 AM)JDW twice Wrote:  Specifically it says, "This will be more comprehensive once complex number support is added to the HP Prime solver, but for now it is just a demo of what is to come."

Could someone "in the know" please explain to me what is meant by "more comprehensive complex number support" on the Prime? I thought the Prime supported complex numbers already.

Yes, Prime supports complex numbers. If I were to GUESS what the author of the quote in question means, I'd GUESS that they want the built-in solver to return complex solutions, which is strange, since Prime already has the cSolve command which does exactly that. Here's the Help screen for cSolve:

Prime Wrote:Syntax:
cSolve(Expr,[Var])

Returns the solutions, including complex solutions, of Expr, for Var.

If Expr is an expression, solves the equation Expr=0.

Examples:
cSolve(x^4=1,x) → {-1,i,1,−i}
cSolve(u*v-u=v and v²=u,[u,v]) → {[0,0],[(1/2*(√5+1))^2,1/2*(√5+1)],[(1/2*(-√5+1))^2,1/2*(-√5+1)]}