Design Ideas for Desktop version of Teenix emulator

[Harald]

Despite not yet having solved all issues with my VFD emulator I built a year ago (the ftdi USB chips keep dieing and I don't know why yet), I have new silly ideas...
I have three display options:

1) IN-12 and IN-15 Nixie tubes:

I think they look quite nice, but they are rather large, not really cheap and only allow emulating classic series calculators. The IN-12 has the symbols 0 through 9 and a decimal point, the IN-15 has the "-". So letters are not possible and the "-" has to be in fixed positions.

2) IGP-17 Panaplex display:
i
It is much smaller than the nixies (quite a good size I'd say), has the same nice colour as the nixies, allows emulation of all the LED models, but can be a bit difficult to obtain and aren't quite as stylish as the nixies.

3)IV-27M VFD tube:

Also allows for all the calculators to be emulated. Fairly cheap and easy to get. The green is probably not quite as nice as the nixie colour. Size is also quite good.

I will use cherry keys for this again, but am wondering wether to use a portrait or landscape layout.

I have included a poll and am looking forward to hearing your opinions.

Cheers,
Harald

[rprosperi]

I think choices for both display-type and keyboard orientation depend strongly on the actual size of the display options. Can you show them relative to some known object (e.g. perhaps laying on or near a Woodstock or Classic machine)?

For example, if as small as a Woodstock display, then I think a vertical keyboard orientation is much preferred, however if they're the size of the HP-97 LEDs, then horizontal seems to make more sense.

[Helix]

I've not yet voted, but here are my thoughts:

- the Nixie tubes don't look nice to me. Furthermore, it would be a pity to emulate only the Classic series calculators. I would drop this solution.

- IGP-17 Panaplex display: why not, even if the numerals are crude.

- IV-27M VFD tube: it seems to have low contrast. Why segments appear white when they are off? I don't like that.

[Jlouis]

Very nice project!

Are you considering make it available to the community?

[Harald]

(09-01-2018 09:47 PM)rprosperi Wrote:  I think choices for both display-type and keyboard orientation depend strongly on the actual size of the display options. Can you show them relative to some known object (e.g. perhaps laying on or near a Woodstock or Classic machine)?

For example, if as small as a Woodstock display, then I think a vertical keyboard orientation is much preferred, however if they're the size of the HP-97 LEDs, then horizontal seems to make more sense.

Yes, I agree, keyboard orientation depends on display size.
The IN-12 nixies are 21mm wide, making a total display width of about 30cm.
The chery keys are 19mm wide. So the landscape layout will be 20cm wide, the portrait 10cm.
The IGP-17 has a width of 17.5cm and the IV-27M is abou 15 cm wide.
I am still waiting for the IGP-17 to arrive. When it is here I can take a picture comparing all the displays.

(09-01-2018 11:21 PM)Helix Wrote:  - IV-27M VFD tube: it seems to have low contrast. Why segments appear white when they are off? I don't like that.

Legibility is indeed not brilliant in bright sunlight. The digits are phosphor coated which emits green light when hit by electrons. But it is white when not lit..
Nixies and panaplax have a dark metal cathodes which has an orrage glow arround it when current is flowing.

(09-01-2018 11:59 PM)Jlouis Wrote:  Are you considering make it available to the community?

If I am satisfied with the design, I will make it available.

[Maximilian Hohmann]

Hello!

If I would have the time I would built something like a modern version of a 300-series Compucorp, i.e. Panaplex display and portrait orientation. There is nothing wrong with the original Compucorpses (which are my second favorite calculator series after the Woodstocks) apart from their size and mass. A modern version could easily be powered from a LiPo battery for many hours without the requirement for a mains connection.

As much as I like Nixie displays I am afraid that the readily available IN12 nixies are about the least beautiful among them. Unfortunately the more beautiful ones are too hard to find to make more than one 12-digit calculator... And a desktop nixie calculator is a really really big device.

Regards
Max

[Paul Dale]

I suspect I'd be up for one regardless of the display and keyboard


Pauli

[Jlouis]

(09-02-2018 10:55 AM)Paul Dale Wrote:  I suspect I'd be up for one regardless of the display and keyboard


Pauli

1+

[rprosperi]

Thanks Harald, looking forward to seeing them when ready.

For a non-handheld size, most often horizontal format makes more sense, but this can depend on other layout options; it will be easier upon seeing them.

But I agree with Paul and JLouis, I'm likely interested in one whatever the final layout.

[teenix]

Good idea.

I came across a few dead HP-97's going cheap on the web but the robot bidders cannot be beaten it seems and I lost out.

I was going to try and use the emulator, with a few mods, to try and resurrect it, minus the printer.

I think the Panaplex displays look the best, although I like the Nixie tubes.

cheers

Tony

[markhen]

How about 5x7 alphanumeric LED displays like the Broadcom HDSP-2532 8 digit displays? They are beautiful, LED, and allow good alpha characters, too?! Admittedly a bit expensive.....

[teenix]

(09-03-2018 01:35 AM)markhen Wrote:  How about 5x7 alphanumeric LED displays like the Broadcom HDSP-2532 8 digit displays? They are beautiful, LED, and allow good alpha characters, too?! Admittedly a bit expensive.....

I looked into these, they do look good, but are a bit power hungry, could be 1/2 amp or more per 8 digits, so not good for battery power.

cheers

Tony

[toml_12953]

(09-03-2018 03:08 AM)teenix Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 01:35 AM)markhen Wrote:  How about 5x7 alphanumeric LED displays like the Broadcom HDSP-2532 8 digit displays? They are beautiful, LED, and allow good alpha characters, too?! Admittedly a bit expensive.....

I looked into these, they do look good, but are a bit power hungry, could be 1/2 amp or more per 8 digits, so not good for battery power.

cheers

Tony

If it's a desktop machine then battery power isn't so important, is it?

[markhen]

I’ve used these in a clock and they don’t use anywhere near half an amp in typical use - that spec might be with all dots illuminated?

[teenix]

(09-03-2018 05:34 AM)toml_12953 Wrote:  If it's a desktop machine then battery power isn't so important, is it?

Good point :-)

(09-03-2018 06:13 AM)markhen Wrote:  I’ve used these in a clock and they don’t use anywhere near half an amp in typical use - that spec might be with all dots illuminated?

The spec sheet says 330 - 480mA with # displayed in all 8 digits at 100% brightness, but I agree, the average consumption will vary. Nearly double that for 15 digits.

cheers

Tony

[rprosperi]

At over $80 for the needed pair, they are definitely on the pricey side....

[ijabbott]

(09-03-2018 03:08 AM)teenix Wrote:  

(09-03-2018 01:35 AM)markhen Wrote:  How about 5x7 alphanumeric LED displays like the Broadcom HDSP-2532 8 digit displays? They are beautiful, LED, and allow good alpha characters, too?! Admittedly a bit expensive.....

I looked into these, they do look good, but are a bit power hungry, could be 1/2 amp or more per 8 digits, so not good for battery power.

How about Lite-On LTG-305HR or LTG-305G? They are 5x7 matrix with a decimal point on the left, with 0.3" (7.62 mm) character height in a 0.386" x 0.728" (9.8 mm x 18.5 mm) package.

http://optoelectronics.liteon.com/upload...-305HR.pdf

[ijabbott]

Winstar make a pretty large range of OLED modules with graphic or character displays. They may be worth considering.

https://www.winstar.com.tw/products/oled-module.html

[Harald]

Following the recent discussion, there are plenty of LED choices for such a project. I just thought it would be boring to use LEDs.
I don't think I can update the poll to include an LED option, but if I do an LED option, that will be at a later stage and simply a one to one copy of Toni's schematic using cherry keys and readyly available LEDs.

[ijabbott]

(09-01-2018 11:21 PM)Helix Wrote:  - IV-27M VFD tube: it seems to have low contrast. Why segments appear white when they are off? I don't like that.

They are usually used behind a filter to obscure the unlit segments.