+- HP Forums (https://www.hpmuseum.org/forum)
+-- Forum: HP Calculators (and very old HP Computers) (/forum-3.html)
+--- Forum: General Forum (/forum-4.html)
+--- Thread: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update (/thread-21514.html)
HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - MeindertKuipers - 03-27-2024 02:20 PM
Hi all,
I have posted an update earlier, announcing that I have been succesfull to implement emulation of the HP-IL module and the PILBox in my Pico-RP2040 breadboard setup. This means that there now is a direct connection via USB to the pyILPER virtual HP-IL devices on a host PC, and the host thinks that a PILBox is connected. The YouTube video below is proof of this:
Next step in the project is to make s suitable PCB, one version for development using a Pico module, and the final product version in the shape of a long module. Besides that the user interface is needs to be improved to make it really useful. In addition there in a microSD card on my breadboard and I want to make this accessible as an HP-IL mass storage device.
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - Johnboy - 03-27-2024 10:41 PM
Nice work Meindert.
I am following closely :-)
Cheers,
John
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - floppy - 03-28-2024 12:46 PM
documentation in the well known page is welcome (interest to sniff an HP71B bus)
http://hp41.kuiprs.nl/hp41.htm
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - MeindertKuipers - 03-28-2024 01:22 PM
(03-28-2024 12:46 PM)floppy Wrote: http://hp41.kuiprs.nl/hp41.htmThe website mentioned above is only for historical reasons and will not be maintained anymore. All public information on my HP41 projects is now on my github at https://github.com/mjakuipers. This includes all sources for the MLDL2000.
An older version my the Pico/RP2040 project is available there, any updates will be done when the time is right. No plans to do an HP71 sniffer or peripheral. Just pickup the public sources from Andrew, Thomas or myself and take that as a starting point for something nice.
For announcements and updates this forum will be the place to watch.
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - Massimo Gnerucci - 03-29-2024 06:41 PM
Excellent job, Meindert!
Gotta have one, when finished.
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - MeindertKuipers - 06-14-2024 05:13 PM
Here is a brief update on my HP41 with RP2040 Pico adventures.
I have had PCB's made for a next step in development, one with a module connector and the second with the Pcio. This is really a development setup to get rid of the very fragile breadboard. Most functions of the PCB work really good, but there are some mistakes that I am fixing on a new version of this PCB of which prototypes have been ordered.
On the functional side there have been no changes, under the hood a lot is changing. One is a change to C++ to enable better integration with the tools that Thomas has made and to make the code better, and I am finally switching over to a new and much better command line interface. In addition I have started to create documentation.
When I have verified the updated PCB a kit will be offered to beta testers with a shoppinglist for components so you can build your own. Some soldering skills required. Initial firmware release will be with a limited set of functions. And you will have to supply your own module connector.
The final product will be an HP41 (long) module. For that I am looking for support to create a suitable 3D printed module housing. The product will be named TULIP4041, short for The ULtimate Intelligent Peripheral for the '41.
I have pictures of the development board, and a render of how the final product could look in my DropBox: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/mhbdilhl5wp6gepg3pzve/AMMntnNp7d6lF7ancawhQIQ?rlkey=8smhlz7jg5iqphx7xqg3jdsnc&dl=0
All information for TULIP4041 will be open source, including the schematics, PCB's and all firmware sources.
Capabilities of TULIP4041:
- HP41 bus tracer with disassembler
- Full ROM/QROM/MLDL emulator with bankswitching
- User Memory and Extended Memory emulation
- Virtual HP-IL & PILBox emulation to a host PC with pyILPer or ILPer
- Micro SD card slot for IL drive simulation and access to ROM, MOD, RAW files
- IR printing with Blinky and much much more
Most of the above features are still in development. Firmware upgrade is really easy.
TULIP4041 is NOT a low power device and should use an external power source most of the time, although it will run on HP41 batteries. And you will have to supply your own module connector!
Many thanks to Andrew for inspiring this project and Thomas for a lot of support and code. HP-IL emulation is based on V41 sources from Christoph and EMU41 by Jean-Francois, from whom I also learned from his PILBox. Thanks to others here in this community for their ongoing support.
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - Monte Dalrymple - 06-14-2024 11:56 PM
(06-14-2024 05:13 PM)MeindertKuipers Wrote: Here is a brief update on my HP41 with RP2040 Pico adventures.
I have had PCB's made for a next step in development, one with a module connector and the second with the Pcio. This is really a development setup to get rid of the very fragile breadboard. Most functions of the PCB work really good, but there are some mistakes that I am fixing on a new version of this PCB of which prototypes have been ordered.
On the functional side there have been no changes, under the hood a lot is changing. One is a change to C++ to enable better integration with the tools that Thomas has made and to make the code better, and I am finally switching over to a new and much better command line interface. In addition I have started to create documentation.
When I have verified the updated PCB a kit will be offered to beta testers with a shoppinglist for components so you can build your own. Some soldering skills required. Initial firmware release will be with a limited set of functions. And you will have to supply your own module connector.
The final product will be an HP41 (long) module. For that I am looking for support to create a suitable 3D printed module housing. The product will be named TULIP4041, short for The ULtimate Intelligent Peripheral for the '41.
I have pictures of the development board, and a render of how the final product could look in my DropBox: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/mhbdilhl5wp6gepg3pzve/AMMntnNp7d6lF7ancawhQIQ?rlkey=8smhlz7jg5iqphx7xqg3jdsnc&dl=0
All information for TULIP4041 will be open source, including the schematics, PCB's and all firmware sources.
Capabilities of TULIP4041:
- HP41 bus tracer with disassembler
- Full ROM/QROM/MLDL emulator with bankswitching
- User Memory and Extended Memory emulation
- Virtual HP-IL & PILBox emulation to a host PC with pyILPer or ILPer
- Micro SD card slot for IL drive simulation and access to ROM, MOD, RAW files
- IR printing with Blinky and much much more
Most of the above features are still in development. Firmware upgrade is really easy.
TULIP4041 is NOT a low power device and should use an external power source most of the time, although it will run on HP41 batteries. And you will have to supply your own module connector!
Many thanks to Andrew for inspiring this project and Thomas for a lot of support and code. HP-IL emulation is based on V41 sources from Christoph and EMU41 by Jean-Francois, from whom I also learned from his PILBox. Thanks to others here in this community for their ongoing support.
Like this module housing? https://www.shapeways.com/product/L99GKC4UW/hp-41-module-long-2pc?optionId=63574373&li=marketplace
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - MeindertKuipers - 06-15-2024 10:59 AM
(06-14-2024 11:56 PM)Monte Dalrymple Wrote: Like this module housing? https://www.shapeways.com/product/L99GKC4UW/hp-41-module-long-2pc?optionId=63574373&li=marketplaceThat is the one indeed, and some adaptations are needed (cutouts for IR led, uSD card and USB connector), but this model is not open source
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - PeterP - 06-17-2024 02:16 PM
Meindert, this is so amazing, absolutely in awe!
Two questions: With regards to the module connector - do you need all lines or only a subset of lines? I presume you need all lines but wanted to check. I am still thinking about a modern module connector which we can easily manufacture without having to cannibalize old modules.
Second - will TULIP replace the PIL Box and connect the hp=41 directly to the PC via HP-IL for up and download of LIF files etc, and full simulation of the HP-IL chain on the PC with all virtual devices?
Again, amazing, and I look forward to a kit and play around with it!
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - MeindertKuipers - 06-17-2024 03:02 PM
(06-17-2024 02:16 PM)PeterP Wrote: Meindert, this is so amazing, absolutely in awe!Thanks Peter, for your encouraging words. And having a modern module connector would be the cherry on the cake of all custom module projects around.
Two questions: With regards to the module connector - do you need all lines or only a subset of lines? I presume you need all lines but wanted to check. I am still thinking about a modern module connector which we can easily manufacture without having to cannibalize old modules.
Second - will TULIP replace the PIL Box and connect the hp=41 directly to the PC via HP-IL for up and download of LIF files etc, and full simulation of the HP-IL chain on the PC with all virtual devices?
Again, amazing, and I look forward to a kit and play around with it!
Answer one: Only 10 lines are used. B3 and B4 are not used, all other lines on the module connector are used
Answer two: TULIP will indeed replace both the IL module AND the PILBox. In this setup it is not possible to connect 'real' HP-IL devices. But this is not completely ruled out by using another gizmo, something that uses a spare serial connection in TULIP and converts that to a real HP-IL interface.
[edit: typo correction]
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - JurgenRo - 06-17-2024 06:14 PM
(03-29-2024 06:41 PM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote: Excellent job, Meindert!
Gotta have one, when finished.
Me too, for sure!
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - Christoph Giesselink - 06-17-2024 11:19 PM
(06-17-2024 03:02 PM)MeindertKuipers Wrote: Answer two: TULIP will indeed replace both the IL module AND the PILBox. In this setup it is not possible to connect 'real' HP-IL devices.
I think that's not true. Connect TULIP with ILPilbox and you have virtual HP-IL. Connect another instance of ILPilbox with virtual HP-IL on one side, the other side a PIL-Box and so you get 'real' HP-IL.
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - Sylvain Cote - 06-18-2024 02:16 AM
(06-17-2024 11:19 PM)Christoph Giesselink Wrote:TMK, one of the TULIP4041 module feature is to replace the HP-IL module and the PIL-Box.(06-17-2024 03:02 PM)MeindertKuipers Wrote: Answer two: TULIP will indeed replace both the IL module AND the PILBox. In this setup it is not possible to connect 'real' HP-IL devices.I think that's not true. Connect TULIP with ILPilbox and you have virtual HP-IL. Connect another instance of ILPilbox with virtual HP-IL on one side, the other side a PIL-Box and so you get 'real' HP-IL.
It does this by implementing the HP-IL internal registers on the NUT CPU side, implementing the USB CDC profile on the other side and the IL over serial framing from Jean-François.
So, you insert the TULIP4041 module in the HP-41, plug the TULIP4041 USB connector to the computer, start one of the HP-IL Virtual software and voila! (a HP-IL loop without HP-IL cabling)
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - rprosperi - 06-18-2024 03:02 AM
(06-17-2024 11:19 PM)Christoph Giesselink Wrote:(06-17-2024 03:02 PM)MeindertKuipers Wrote: Answer two: TULIP will indeed replace both the IL module AND the PILBox. In this setup it is not possible to connect 'real' HP-IL devices.
I think that's not true. Connect TULIP with ILPilbox and you have virtual HP-IL. Connect another instance of ILPilbox with virtual HP-IL on one side, the other side a PIL-Box and so you get 'real' HP-IL.
I'm glad to hear you say this Christoph!
I was wondering if ILPilbox would allow this and now you've said exactly what I was wondering about.
Looking forward to planting some Tulips when they are ready!!
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - MeindertKuipers - 06-18-2024 11:59 AM
(06-17-2024 11:19 PM)Christoph Giesselink Wrote:Good point. Untested but no reason why it should not work.(06-17-2024 03:02 PM)MeindertKuipers Wrote: Answer two: TULIP will indeed replace both the IL module AND the PILBox. In this setup it is not possible to connect 'real' HP-IL devices.
I think that's not true. Connect TULIP with ILPilbox and you have virtual HP-IL. Connect another instance of ILPilbox with virtual HP-IL on one side, the other side a PIL-Box and so you get 'real' HP-IL.
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - foldedtoad - 08-30-2024 12:26 AM
Where can I find current status on this project?
Are updates on a different thread?
Thanks for any information.
RE: HP41 with Pico RP2040 attached, update - MeindertKuipers - 08-30-2024 12:57 PM
(08-30-2024 12:26 AM)foldedtoad Wrote: Where can I find current status on this project?See this thread: https://www.hpmuseum.org/forum/thread-22215.html
Are updates on a different thread?
Thanks for any information.