HP-65: Was this item in space?

HP-65: Was this item in space? - Printable Version

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HP-65: Was this item in space? - jebem - 04-12-2015 06:34 PM

The HP-65 was used in space during the Apollo-Soyuz missions.

The item in this auction seems to be unique in the world and genuine, including pictures with original autographs of the crew, with Certificate of Authenticity.

But was this specific item in space?
If yes, the sky high asking price is not so exaggerated if one have the money to spend on such an collector specimen.

RE: HP-65: Was this item in space? - walter b - 04-12-2015 06:52 PM

Hmmmh - I doubt it for several reasons.

This seller is trying to sell this for a very long time.
AFAICS he's not showing anything which proves that this particular calculator was on a space mission.
Anything like a NASA inventory plate on the case would be nice but I can't see it.
I can't see what that postcard shall tell in this context beyond being a rare souvenir for sure. Same for the photographs.

Ceterum censeo ut caveat emptor.

d:-/

RE: HP-65: Was this item in space? - renif - 04-12-2015 08:04 PM

Offers like this one can be seen over and over again on TAS. As a carefull reader you have to ask: What exactly is offered in the auction?

Answer : A calculator of the type which was used in the Apollo-Soyuz mission, a poster showing the astronauts and cosmonauts, a postcard with their signatures. The seller does not claim that this specific calculator has been used onboard the Apollo spacecraft. He doesn't even claim that the calculator for sale ever has been owned by NASA or used by one of the astronauts. Of course, he does not show the slightest inclination to diffuse the impression that his calculator is unique ("gibt es sonst weltweit nicht zu kaufen"). That's probably true. As long as nobody else ties up a parcel consisting of any old HP-65, a Poster and a fancy postcard with signatures of some astronauts and cosmonauts.

So, if you think the certified postcard is worth at least 1500 Euro minus the usual market value for an ordinary HP-65, try and get it. As Walter already noticed, you would be the first for a long time. For me, the asking price is absolutely utopian. The real value for this lot should be somewhere between 500 and 800 Euro.

On the other hand we must give the seller credit for his clever story, not violating the historical frame. There are other offers with less respect for historical facts. Like that one: http://www.quoka.de/sammlungen-seltenes/sonstige-sammlungen/c3900a118938984/taschenrechner-hp-41cv-einsatz-1mondflug.html, whrere an HP-41CV is for sale.
[irony mode ON]
That little machine has made all the long way to the moon and back to mother earth, only to be offered to you, yes you, for next to nothing. Hurry!
[irony mode OFF]

I told the seller, that the 41C has been developed in the late seventies and was first built in the year 1979. So, it should be quite unlikely that his calculator had the chance to take part in the first manned lunar landing, which took place in 1969. That little discrepancy did not disturb him in the least. His offer is repeated every week. Caveat emptor as Walter and american law say... Wink

Under german law both offers can be considered misleading at best. In the case of the "lunar" HP-41CV it's either attempted fraud, pure ignorance, or a combination of both.

RE: HP-65: Was this item in space? - PANAMATIK - 04-12-2015 10:32 PM

(04-12-2015 06:34 PM)jebem Wrote: But was this specific item in space?
If yes, the sky high asking price is not so exaggerated if one have the money to spend on such an collector specimen.

I asked the seller some weeks ago, whether the astronauts have signed their autographs on the back of the calculator. He answered, that he cannot tell exactly that, but the production date matches 1:1 the flight date..... Sad

Bernhard

RE: HP-65: Was this item in space? - TASP - 04-13-2015 03:03 AM

As far as I know, the software on the cards has never been listed anywhere.

I'm not sure we could ascertain the provenance of any magnetic cards he might have, or whether or not the data on them are even recoverable now, but, it would be a start to establish a claim.

If the programs on his card plausibly utilize numeric inputs available on the flight instruments, and yield numeric outputs appropriate for whatever backup function the calculator was to provide . . . .

IOW, he doesn't have a prayer, LOL.

RE: HP-65: Was this item in space? - Thomas Radtke - 04-13-2015 10:47 AM

(04-12-2015 06:34 PM)jebem Wrote: But was this specific item in space?

If it was, I think the seller would have stated it.

RE: HP-65: Was this item in space? - Thomas Ritschel - 04-13-2015 11:45 AM

(04-12-2015 06:34 PM)jebem Wrote: But was this specific item in space?

It's interesting to note that the same seller already sold such a calculator for 1600 EUR about one year ago, titled: "HP-65 in extrem guter Erhaltung in excellent condition Apollo Soyuz mission 1++". It's no longer accessible by it's item number (130771293696) but still listed in his feedback.

So, it's even more questionable...

RE: HP-65: Was this item in space? - Maximilian Hohmann - 04-13-2015 12:25 PM

(04-13-2015 11:45 AM)Thomas Ritschel Wrote: So, it's even more questionable...

No, these calculators were never in space. In his current item description he even mentions that he already sold a calculator like this one. Nowhere does he write that any of his pieces were actually flown. The manually labelled magnetic cards that are visible in one picture seem to contain some TVM program rather than orbital mechanics.

What I find interesting is the letter with the ASTP astronauts autographs. It is addressed to the most well known designer of space art around here. He must have been in his late teens when he got that envelope from Russia. I wonder why he parted with it, because on his website he shows all kinds of collectibles including a personal letter from Neil Armstrong.

Regrads
Max