How do I format an HP-48GX FRAM Card?

[JDW]

Back in Jan. 2017, I purchased an 128K FRAM card and installed Meta Kernel on it using Hoppi. The card and Meta Kernel worked flawlessly all that time until today. But today when I press ON, I see this:

Warning:
Invalid Card Data

I've tried a soft reset and also the paper clip reset under the upper right rubber foot, to no avail. Pulling out the card and reseating it did nothing good.

I want to reformat/erase the card to see if that will even work. If it doesn't, that would mean the card may be dead.

How do I ERASE or otherwise FORMAT my 128K FRAM card in slot 1?

[rprosperi]

Try PINIT before wiping the card.

[L-shift] [2] [NXT] [port number] [PINIT]

[JDW]

Bob, thank you for the advice.

I had actually tried the raw command "PINIT" before I posted here (based on something I Googled), but I did not try "[L-shift] [2] [NXT] [port number] [PINIT]" as you suggested. But when you say "port number" I assume you mean the card slot number, correct? It's slot 1. So I assume that means the following should be correct:

[L-shift] [2] [NXT] [1] [PINIT]

(I'm at home now and the 48GX is at the office, so I will try it tomorrow morning.)

[AndiGer]

Card battery still ok?
Andi

[JanS]

Unless you merged the 128K Memory Card in physical Slot one with the Main Memory, your PINIT Command should be fine. Here's more information about the quirks of Memory Cards in the two different Slots and their respective PORT assignments.

https://www.hpmuseum.org/cgi-sys/cgiwrap...read=89814
https://www.drehersoft.com/managing-hp-48sx48gx-ports/

Basically PORT is a 128KB Memory Object. PORT 0 on a GX is the 128K internal RAM. PORT 1 becomes whatever 128K is available in physical card slot 1 or 2, whichever is populated. If both are populated, the 128K in physical slot 1 becomes PORT1, any subsequent 128K Memory chunks available in physical slot 2 become port 2, 3 etc.

Physical Slot 1 is special in two ways:
1) Only 128K are usable and therefore only a 128K card is officially supported
2) a 128K card in physical slot one by default becomes PORT1, but can be merged with main memory (and the card then cannot be removed before unmerging or you will encounter a memory lost condition)


hope that helps.

[JDW]

(07-30-2024 03:44 PM)AndiGer Wrote:  Card battery still ok?
Andi

FRAM cards do not have batteries, and that was my inspiration for purchasing it back in Jan. 2017. I put Meta Kernel on it, and it worked flawlessly until I pressed the ON button a day ago. Now I get the aforementioned error message on every Power-ON.

I will try Bob’s suggestion in a few hours when I get to the office, then report back here.

[JDW]

(07-30-2024 12:07 PM)rprosperi Wrote:  Try PINIT before wiping the card.
[L-shift] [2] [NXT] [port number] [PINIT]

Bob, it didn't work. Here's a short video showing exactly what I did:

https://youtu.be/Nr3bxuFw4Io

So unless there is another option here, I see no other choice but to format the card. Even so, I have forgotten the precise commands needed to format, so if someone could kindly hold my hand, step-by-step through the exact process, I would be sincerely grateful.

Thanks.

(P.S. The rolling flicker see on the LCD in my video is from overhead LED lighting, not anything problematic with the 48GX.)

[rprosperi]

If PINIT doesn't fix it I'm not sure of next steps. There is no format command that I recall, PINIT was added in the GX to accomplish that by restoring the proper headers, etc to be able to access the card. On Normal RAM cards, simply removing the battery did a full wipe and then one used PINIT.

Two things to try:

1. Toggle the read/write switch a couple times to ensure it's not the casue

2. Just write some variable to the card and see if it works - this was the normal way of restoring a RAM card on an SX (since it did not have PINIT)

[9aplus]

@JDW
May I suggest to =>
Try to spray some WD40 in that switch, than move few times.
Wipe with clean paper tissue, than try again.

[KeithB]

WD-40?

I think some deoxit might work better.

[JDW]

Here is my video reply to all of you:

https://youtu.be/Ri7RDCe8WnY

[rprosperi]

Personally, I would have a trusted the statement "I checked the switch, it's OK".... LOL

There is no built-in method for formatting RAM cards as none was needed; remove the battery and *POOF*, it's formatted. There was no FRAM at the time, so no provision was made to do this by HP.

When several guys have have introduced FRAM cards over the years, this very topic was often raised, with potential buyers asking "how would I clear the card, since there is no Format?" and the seller (not necessarily your seller) replying "It's not needed, PINIT or just writing a variable should be all you need", which is likely true for a new, properly functioning card. Nevertheless, I too bought one but have been lucky and had no issues with it.

My suggestion is to create a new thread (or rename the initial post of this one) to something like "How do I format an HP-48GX FRAM Card?" to get readers' attention that it's a FRAM-related issue, and that may attract more eyes from folks that may have dealt with this issue.

[Kiwi]

The card mentions that it's a "HP48GX card" but 128K (F)RAM should work in a HP48SX too.
Maybe it's worth trying to put the card in slot 2 (in stead of slot 1) and launch the PINIT command again.

[JDW]

(08-01-2024 12:00 PM)rprosperi Wrote:  My suggestion is to create a new thread (or rename the initial post of this one) to something like "How do I format an HP-48GX FRAM Card?" to get readers' attention...

Title of opening post now renamed! Thanks for the suggestion, Bob!

(08-01-2024 12:16 PM)Kiwi Wrote:  Maybe it's worth trying to put the card in slot 2 (in stead of slot 1) and launch the PINIT command again.

I followed your advice. Boy, that was scary. Switched off power, pulled the card, inserted it into Slot 2. Powered on and got the warning message. Then I did this:

[L-shift] [2] [NXT] [2] [PINIT]

The screen went blank. Looked dead. Pressing ON did nothing. I was getting ready to freak out. Flipped the calculator over with keys down and started pulling on the card. Then I heard a beep sound. Flipped the calculator over and saw it had powered on. But oddly, it would suddenly power off and on again. And when the screen goes blank, there's nothing you can press to wake or power it on. You just must wait. So after it finally powered on again, I powered it off, then pulled the card and tested. All is now well.

Let me know your thoughts in light of this.

[rprosperi]

(08-02-2024 12:24 AM)JDW Wrote:  ...So after it finally powered on again, I powered it off, then pulled the card and tested. All is now well.

Let me know your thoughts in light of this.

By "all is now well", do you mean the card is also acting properly, or only that the GX is back to normal?

[JDW]

(08-02-2024 12:52 AM)rprosperi Wrote:  By "all is now well", do you mean the card is also acting properly, or only that the GX is back to normal?

Card still appears to be dead. I put it back into Slot 1 and confirmed nothing has changed. But with the card removed, the 48GX is functioning normally.

[rprosperi]

Port-1 and Port-2 in a GX are indeed different, this is how Port-2 can use bank-switching to access up to 32 128KB banks, so it's not totally surprising to see different behavior.

Was the FRAM card intended to only be used in Port-1, or is that simply how you had your GX set up?

Looking more and more like the card is defective...

Have you tried contacting the person that sold the card? Often, years later, that person has moved on and isn't reachable, but it's certainly worth a try.

[JDW]

(08-02-2024 02:09 AM)rprosperi Wrote:  Was the FRAM card intended to only be used in Port-1, or is that simply how you had your GX set up?

Have you tried contacting the person that sold the card?

Bob, I made a graphic of the original EBAY listing from Dec. 2016 here, because EBAY for some reason only allows me to view it:

https://kiramek.com/21test95/FRAM_Card_EBAY.png

As you can see from the description, it says it was designed for either slot, but the closing sentence says "Currently, SLOT1 use only!"

I've only used it in Slot1 because I had the understanding at the time I first installed it that 128K cards with Meta Kernel should go into Slot1 when used in the 48GX.

I wrote to the seller, slvr00gt, a few moments ago via EBAY and informed him of this forum discussion, asking for his advice on how to format the card.

[gege]

Maybe try the chkmem program.

  chkmem.zip (Size: 119.82 KB / Downloads: 12)

[rprosperi]

As suspected, the "slot 1 use only" warning confirms that the card could not handle the bank switching logic used in port-2, which explains the very strange behavior your GX exhibited when trying it in that port. That is probably not related to the overall memory issue, but at least that mystery is resolved. Hopefully the seller has some technique for resolving it.