Swiss Micros makes HP 'act-alikes' - programmable

[toml_12953]

(12-29-2016 05:45 PM)Briancady413 Wrote:  https://www.swissmicros.com/

I haven't purchased any, but thought others might like to hear of this company. If you are familiar with Swiss Micros, would you rate the company in the following poll: (1-5 for low-to-high quality)

Brian

The build quality is impressive. I never hesitate to recommend them to people looking for a classic HP calculator.

Tom L

[Alejandro Paz(Germany)]

I saw the 42P prototype at the Allschwil meeting last fall, I'm sure everyone on that room is going to buy one when they come out, I know I will . I'm still amazed.

[grsbanks]

(03-21-2017 11:18 AM)Alejandro Paz(Germany) Wrote:  I saw the 42P prototype at the Allschwil meeting last fall, I'm sure everyone on that room is going to buy one when they come out, I know I will . I'm still amazed.

I wasn't in the room and I'll probably buy one too, even if just so I can compare with the original 42S! The reputations of SM and Free42 combined in one device is surely a recipe for success.

[bhtooefr]

I had to resolder the studs on my DM-15CC, and the keys are pretty stiff on it, but it's a rather nice device.

Looking forward to the DM42, and I've only seen pictures and videos of it. I'll probably get one. It'll also be interesting as a platform for various third-party calculator firmwares (ideally suited to WP-43S and newRPL, and I could even see it being useful for non-HP-like firmware), in addition to the Free42-based functionality as shipped.

[vido]

(03-21-2017 05:06 PM)bhtooefr Wrote:  [...] the DM42 [...]. It'll also be interesting as a platform for various third-party calculator firmwares (ideally suited to WP-43S and newRPL, and I could even see it being useful for non-HP-like firmware), in addition to the Free42-based functionality as shipped.

And that, my friend, is a major reason to buy more than one DM-42 !

[Dave Britten]

(03-21-2017 10:56 PM)vido Wrote:  

(03-21-2017 05:06 PM)bhtooefr Wrote:  [...] the DM42 [...]. It'll also be interesting as a platform for various third-party calculator firmwares (ideally suited to WP-43S and newRPL, and I could even see it being useful for non-HP-like firmware), in addition to the Free42-based functionality as shipped.

And that, my friend, is a major reason to buy more than one DM-42 !

I'd certainly love to have one on my desk and one in my computer bag, but that will depend heavily on the final price point.

[grsbanks]

I now own three SwissMicros units. A DM12L, DM16L and DM41L. Well, four if you count the DM42 beta unit delivered to work (and I'm working from home today, worst luck...)

I can concur that the hardware is of excellent quality. These Voyager-like units are built like tanks and the rubber feet both make them stay in one place on the desk and reduce the noise of the keyboard action.

They are also incredibly flexible. Over time, the DM41L has become my "go to" machine but I preferred the action of the DM12L. So, what did I do? I swapped over the guts of the machines (the keyboard domes are fixed to the printed circuit board) and simply re-flashed them with the firmware to match the front plate and keys. (Very minor) problem solved!

Computation-wise these machines behave exactly as the original HP machines do, but considerably faster, because they use the original HP microcode running on an ARM-based system clocked at up to 48MHz. The exception to this is obviously the DM42, which uses Thomas Okken's Free42 and the Intel BCD library instead of the original HP-42S microcode.

It has also been mentioned that SwissMicros provide regular firmware updates to iron out problems and add new features. It's true. See here for the firmware history. I've recently been involved in the testing of an across-the-board update that brings some interesting stuff to the table, so development of these products is alive and well. Before you ask, I will say no more than this...

Given the attention to detail in the manufacture of these machines and the level of access to the guys who actually design them that you get, I do feel that the term "knock-off" was a little unfair.

[EdS2]

(12-30-2016 04:30 PM)Briancady413 Wrote:  

(12-29-2016 08:34 PM)Mark Hardman Wrote:  Perhaps it wasn't your intent, but I take slight umbrage at the use of the term "knockoffs."...

Mark Hardman

HI Mark,

My apologies to Swiss Micros and to all for casually calling 'knockoffs' what is clearly a reputable company's product. Congratulations to Swiss Micros for the high poll results they've earned from among us.

Brian

Brian, perhaps you could modify the thread title? You only need to edit your head post and update the Subject.

[Geoff Quickfall]

I second that, it keeps grabbing my attention!

[Hsilop]

How about changing "-offs" to "-outs"? :-)

[EdS2]

Thanks for updating the thread title, Brian!

[edryer]

I own an HP-16C (1985 manufactured) and now also a DM-16CC.

Actually purchased used and was advertised as a DM-16L, but they sent me a DM-16CC by mistake, as it was a great price I didn't complain, and actually quite like the credit card version. One thing I noticed is how extremely well made the device is, it frankly is grade A build, you really couldn't get any better. Now what I'd like Swiss Micros to do in the future, is put a HP-feel "proper" keyboard on the 16CC (never mind the 16L ) it would be small yes, but wow... it would blow my mind.

The seller also has a DM-15L so I just buy it today (will come in a few days or so) and I am fully expecting a DM-15CC as the guy seems clueless about the devices ))))

Well done Swiss Micros, I love the DM-16CC, and it compliments my HP-16C perfectly!

[pinkman]

I like SwissMicro products and I appreciate Mickael's availability by mail or on the SM forum , but I was really disappointed by the quality of the products I could try.
I first bought a DM41CC, really happy and excited, but it had a defect with the clock. Because I chose to own a 41 for the time and alarm functions, it was a real deception.
Mickael tested other devices and could not find a CC without the same problem, so he sent me a L model, and it has the problem also. He sent me another L but the LCD wasn't nice, with glitches on it.
Mickael told me to cook it in the oven for a few hours (70°C), I did it three or four times and the glitches decreased but didn't disappeared.

Finally I sent the device back and bought a 85' 15C. No alarms, slower, but of incredible quality.

[edryer]

I should add the DM-16CC I have is the "Silver Edition" which I believe is Titanium so can't comment on the Non Silver edition.

I opened it up and it looks very neat and tidy inside, one PCB with a few chips (maybe just one can't remember), battery and two surface mounted microswitches. I'd imagine reliability of the electronics are superb.

Flashed from V16 to V27 firmware with linux "lpc21isp" that I had to build for Fedora 25, very straightforward, took a few minutes to build and a minute to flash.

[grsbanks]

(09-10-2018 08:23 PM)edryer Wrote:  I should add the DM-16CC I have is the "Silver Edition" which I believe is Titanium so can't comment on the Non Silver edition.

I opened it up and it looks very neat and tidy inside, one PCB with a few chips (maybe just one can't remember), battery and two surface mounted microswitches. I'd imagine reliability of the electronics are superb.

Flashed from V16 to V27 firmware with linux "lpc21isp" that I had to build for Fedora 25, very straightforward, took a few minutes to build and a minute to flash.

All the credit card size SwissMicros calculators have titanium backs except for a few early models. I have one of the first DM41s that has a brass back! Titanium is notoriously difficult to work, which is why they're waiting on more of them to resume sales of the small models. They're difficult to source!

There should be 2 chips on the PCB if memory serves. The larger of them is the LPC1115 CPU that also includes FLASH for the ROM and 8KB of static RAM. The second, smaller chip is a PCF8563 real time clock chip.

Just as a side note, the credit card size calculators have no suffix on their names and the full-size "Voyager" format machines have an "L" suffix, so your machine is a DM16 (as opposed to the full-size DM16L).

[Mark Hardman]

(09-11-2018 07:29 AM)grsbanks Wrote:  Just as a side note, the credit card size calculators have no suffix on their names and the full-size "Voyager" format machines have an "L" suffix, so your machine is a DM16 (as opposed to the full-size DM16L).

I just checked the invoice for my first purchase from SwissMicros. It shows that I purchased a DM-15CC. This was the first generation where the case was composed of layers of PC boards and the back label was made of copper traces.

Even the firmware revision history refers to this generation as DM-1xCC:

V1: 10.2.2012:
initial versions DM15CC, DM16CC


It wasn't until V11 of the firmware that the credit-card sized models were renamed:

V11: 22.01.2013
fixed SST autorepeat delay for 10C, 11C and 12C
all model names are reduced from DM1xCC to DM1x
extended memory version renamed from MEM80/MEM1B to M80/M1B

[grsbanks]

Thanks Mark. Today I learned!

[edryer]

"The second, smaller chip is a PCF8563 real time clock chip."

Both my DM-15 an DM-16 when viewing the status information have the "NORTC" label displayed and attempting to enable the RTC fails... completely ignored, can't recall but I suspect that there is no real-time clock chip on my models!

Back of DM-15 (Credit Card Size model) says DM-15 and http://www.SwissMicros.com
Back of DM-16 (Credit Card Size model) states DM-16CC and http://www.rpn-calc.ch

The later DM-15 keyboard seems slightly firmer, but both are good.

[Eddie W. Shore]

I'm saving up for a DM42 (42nd birthday present next March?).

I have a DM41L, that I bought around my 41st birthday.

[/align]

[grsbanks]

(09-16-2018 06:37 PM)edryer Wrote:  Both my DM-15 an DM-16 when viewing the status information have the "NORTC" label displayed and attempting to enable the RTC fails... completely ignored, can't recall but I suspect that there is no real-time clock chip on my models!

Early hardware revisions had no RTC. It was introduced later on to provide a clock for the DM41's emulation of the Time Module.