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Giancarlo · 05-14-2014, 08:20 PM

Hello,
What the sintax could be for the new input command?

Thanks

Giancarlo

Craig Thomas · 05-14-2014, 10:09 PM

(05-14-2014 06:59 PM)Mic Wrote: not a good omen...

When the original engineers that found companies based on solid products and good service are gone, this is usually what's left.

Tim simply works for a large corporation that doesn't have customer service and satisfaction as a priority.

They want to make money, which I agree with, but I disagree with their priorities that shape how they try and do it.

Alfon · 05-15-2014, 12:18 AM

Maybe an option on the Prime for HP 50 emulation may be a good idea- ? That way there are 2 calculators in one- and maybe an additional 'linux' feature option as well?

Angus · (This post was last modified: 05-15-2014 11:58 AM by Angus.)

Quote:When the original engineers that found companies based on solid products and good service are gone, this is usually what's left.

Tim simply works for a large corporation that doesn't have customer service and satisfaction as a priority.

They want to make money, which I agree with, but I disagree with their priorities that shape how they try and do it.

That is what all is about.....

As I understood any development cost played, plays and will play a major role when it comes to decisions about the prime.
I doubt, that such things - nice as they are - will ever play a role. Let's hope that HP decides to do the best of the things we have and makes a finished product to make us happy and HP feel proud.

Th emarketing IS proud right now. Read Tim's post about the prime made its way into the schools. As long as selling numbers are as expected, everything is fine.
Calculator department is small; I hope that other HP products go more into details and are not as strictly calculated. For me a great products goes further than an ok-product in certain aspects. I always thought of HP as a company who tried to be better than the rest.

Personally a would say an open Linux would be far beyond what is good for the product. Then go for an android device or so. A good as could be calculator should be more than just numbers, but still remain what it is.

eried · 05-15-2014, 06:51 PM

So, no new fw? German cake is a lie!

Tugdual · (This post was last modified: 05-17-2014 02:10 PM by Tugdual.)

(05-14-2014 03:19 PM)Tim Wessman Wrote: So I would just like to point out that this was not someone authorized to be communicating future information (HP except in very rare, exceptional cases *NEVER* communicates future information of any kind) so when/if no updates arrive in May.... please don't blame HP as we didn't do it.

When/if something comes out, feel free to blame that something didn't come out sooner, that is didn't have feature X, that bug Y wasn't resolved, etc, but don't blame HP for not adhering to a timetable HP did not give.

Tim, when I read your message I feel somehow sad and concerned.
I see you guys staying in the background and avoiding blame for things you didn't promise. I get the message, won't be unfair but this is not the kind of mature communication we customers expect from a professional company. Where are the accountability and the engagement? Most companies have clear schedule and the courage to communicate them and when they don't reach the date, still they demonstrated an attitude to move ahead and a few months delay is not the end of the world. Look at the "pre-purchase" in the gaming industry. I would never thought this would happen...
Finally it is all about developing a winning culture.
Sorry if I sound abrupt, be sure I have very much respect for you as a person but sometime sounds like a cold shower is necessary to wake up.

debrouxl · (This post was last modified: 05-17-2014 02:44 PM by debrouxl.)

FWIW, from the POV of a regular user, TI and Casio don't have a clear schedule for OS upgrade availability dates either...

Tugdual · 05-17-2014, 03:43 PM

(05-17-2014 02:43 PM)debrouxl Wrote: FWIW, from the POV of a regular user, TI and Casio don't have a clear schedule for OS upgrade availability dates either...

So it is even easier to nail competition...

jgreenb2 · 05-17-2014, 08:25 PM

@Tugdual -- IMHO you are way out of line. When someone takes the time to engage with users they deserve respect, not scorn. This isn't an HP forum. Tim participates here to help users (as does Parisse). If you don't approve of HP's policies, write a letter to Meg Whitman.

Oh...and an apology would be in order too.

Tugdual · (This post was last modified: 05-17-2014 09:07 PM by Tugdual.)

(05-17-2014 08:25 PM)jgreenb2 Wrote: @Tugdual -- IMHO you are way out of line. When someone takes the time to engage with users they deserve respect, not scorn. This isn't an HP forum. Tim participates here to help users (as does Parisse). If you don't approve of HP's policies, write a letter to Meg Whitman.

Oh...and an apology would be in order too.

Please read carefully my notes and tell me when I have been rude and/or impolite to the point I need to apologize?
You don't seem to have understood my words. Though Tim signs that his words do not engage Hp's responsibility, it was obvious to me that he was speaking for Hp. I answer to this with my customer opinion and I shall certainly not apologize for my words, it is Hp, not Apple so I think we still have a right to speak openly.
See? Hp, no Tim.

Nigel (UK) · (This post was last modified: 05-17-2014 10:38 PM by Nigel (UK).)

(05-14-2014 03:19 PM)Tim Wessman Wrote: So I would just like to point out that this was not someone authorized to be communicating future information (HP except in very rare, exceptional cases *NEVER* communicates future information of any kind) so when/if no updates arrive in May.... please don't blame HP as we didn't do it.

When/if something comes out, feel free to blame that something didn't come out sooner, that is didn't have feature X, that bug Y wasn't resolved, etc, but don't blame HP for not adhering to a timetable HP did not give.

I use my Prime nearly every day (I'm a physics teacher). The most recent firmware update stopped the crashes and the remaining bugs don't have much impact on me. Of course an update would be nice, but the calculator works well enough for me to use it with confidence. I'd much rather the update be released when it's ready, and not simply to fit a schedule.

I'm don't know how many people are working on the HP firmware update, but I fear it isn't all that many. With a small team it must be hard to guarantee completion to a satisfactory standard by a certain date, and I quite understand why TW (and HP) don't want to make themselves hostages to fortune by committing themselves to a date in advance.

TW: you (and others) have done a great job so far. Keep up the good work - and don't rush it!

Nigel (UK)

Tim Wessman · (This post was last modified: 05-17-2014 11:44 PM by Tim Wessman.)

Hello,

Basically, I just saw that there were a lot of people starting to get very excited due to it being 1/2 way through May. Though that isn't the way HP gives out information and nor was that person authorized to speak for HP, I just wanted to gently remind people not to get angry for HP not hitting a date that HP did not set or give. In no way was I offended by anything written in this thread.

Were I the dictator of life, the universe and everything it might be different, but I do understand why **nearly all** companies don't give out that type of information or as as transparent as those on the outside might wish. It's just the reality of what happens when you have a legal department.

jebem · (This post was last modified: 05-18-2014 12:41 AM by jebem.)

(05-17-2014 10:38 PM)Nigel (UK) Wrote:
(05-14-2014 03:19 PM)Tim Wessman Wrote: So I would just like to point out that this was not someone authorized to be communicating future information (HP except in very rare, exceptional cases *NEVER* communicates future information of any kind) so when/if no updates arrive in May.... please don't blame HP as we didn't do it.

When/if something comes out, feel free to blame that something didn't come out sooner, that is didn't have feature X, that bug Y wasn't resolved, etc, but don't blame HP for not adhering to a timetable HP did not give.

TW: you (and others) have done a great job so far. Keep up the good work - and don't rush it!

I believe all of us, HP-Prime owners, are grateful to have Tim Wessman and Cyrille de Brebisson, Bernard Parisse, and Han to name but a few, that have actively helped us here in this forum.

This issue just happened because Moravia (The Europe's leading distributor of HP calculators) on 14-April has released information on the next firmware features, and a non specific release date: ( "That should be in May. When it's available, you will read it first on this site!" ).

As a matter of fact Klaas Kuperus of Moravia has just published in their forum:
"KlaasKuperus 14:42
Hi all. The message I gave was from Jason Smith, PM with HP. Smile

I am in merely a messenger, Trying to keep you all updated."

So, after this announcement, it is only natural that we can assume that the firmware update is built, tested, and ready to be released.
If it is not, then let them take the time to fix the remaining known issues, test it again at will, and who knows, one day we will be pleased with a even better calculator.

I work essentially on VMware vSphere virtualization solutions (consulting and as a VCI) and I know what I can expect from such a corporation: every single year they release a new version by September (with Beta releases distributed to selected partners many months in advance), and at least one software update per year to fix the known issues.
But this is a different business and a different corporation vision.

Now, nobody reads the software license agreement small characters letter, but it is there that the supplier of the software is by no means responsible for damages and losses resulting from the use of their technologies, and that the product is licensed "as is". So the legal aspect is covered since the beginning.

I'm not pushing HP to announce release dates of anything. HP has his own vision of the market. They know better than me for sure!
So, two different corporations, two different market areas and strategies.

Kevin Ouellet · 05-20-2014, 05:25 PM

I am also grateful that certain HP staff actually participates in hobbyist forums to give help or info. It shows they are at least listening to customers in a way, unlike certain two other companies (although TI-France is fine).

Also, TI does not necessarily respect his OS release time frames either. For example, OS 3.6 came out months after it was supposed to do so, yet, still retains many bugs from the last half a decade or so.

I would rather see the new HP Prime firmware be delayed but be polished more, than seeing a rushed product.

CR Haeger · (This post was last modified: 05-20-2014 08:13 PM by CR Haeger.)

(05-17-2014 11:41 PM)Tim Wessman Wrote: ... It's just the reality of what happens when you have a legal department.

Thanks Tim. I have some $$ down on what may become a new vehicle: Elio Motors and I think their legal group cant commit to a production date yet either.

Question - can your lawyers code or debug the Prime? Ill take no response:=no

Best,
Carl

patiently waiting for a new vehicle with any horsepower and an HP Prime with a little more.

Manolo Sobrino · 05-20-2014, 11:03 PM

It has always surprised me why people buy a product before they think it's finished. Well, you knew that, didn't you? HP may or may not release an update, and if they do, they'll do it when it's good for them, the truth is they are not obliged to do so. I didn't see any notice about upcoming updates on the box of the Prime the last time I saw one, nor that you were getting support beyond obvious malfunction of the device. When I buy something I expect just that and that's why I buy it... if it gets better fine, but if I'm not satisfied with it now why did I just pay with non-upgradeable money?

CR Haeger · (This post was last modified: 05-21-2014 12:30 AM by CR Haeger.)

No big deal. If it gets even more finished then I'll be even more satisfied.

In the meantime, I use the Prime daily at work.

Joe Horn · 05-22-2014, 04:54 AM

(05-20-2014 11:03 PM)Manolo Sobrino Wrote: It has always surprised me why people buy a product before they think it's finished.

There are several good reasons. I can't speak for all "early adopters", but I certainly enjoy being one, and IMHO the phenomenon is explained very well here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_adopter

Kevin Ouellet · 05-24-2014, 04:19 AM

(05-20-2014 11:03 PM)Manolo Sobrino Wrote: HP may or may not release an update, and if they do, they'll do it when it's good for them, the truth is they are not obliged to do so

I sure hope that they don't let it die like the HP 39gII, though.

cutterjohn · 05-24-2014, 12:28 PM

(05-22-2014 04:54 AM)Joe Horn Wrote:
(05-20-2014 11:03 PM)Manolo Sobrino Wrote: It has always surprised me why people buy a product before they think it's finished.

There are several good reasons. I can't speak for all "early adopters", but I certainly enjoy being one, and IMHO the phenomenon is explained very well here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_adopter

Silly me. I expect a finished product when something is generally offered at retail, instead of finished hardware plus just shown the oven firmware.

I suppose that next time I run out to buy a car I shouldn't feel obliged to complain if it's missing a few tires...

Anyways, I wouldn't expect an update soon, as it's Memorial Day weekend in the US... maybe late next week...