DM41X

[toml_12953]

I'm curious as to why people would choose this over the DM42. I'm already have a DM42 and am thinking about getting the DM41X after the beta is over but I wonder why someone would want this instead of the DM42.

[jthole]

Edit: my resistance didn't last long ... just ordered a beta unit -)

About why a DM41X instead of a DM42? Keyboard layout, no menus, and (less relevant to me) access to all(?) HP-41C modules.

[Massimo Gnerucci]

(01-22-2020 03:42 AM)Sylvain Cote Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 03:28 AM)brierand Wrote:  Thank you, Sylvain, I did the same.

Thanks to Robert Prosperi, one of the alpha testers, he's the one that warned me that the beta was now available.

Thank you Robert from me, and here, too

[Massimo Gnerucci]

(01-22-2020 09:37 AM)jthole Wrote:  (and I love the DM41L) but I am allergic for a keyboard that doesn't feel right

This sentence contains an oxymoron.

[Massimo Gnerucci]

(01-22-2020 06:28 AM)toml_12953 Wrote:  I'm curious as to why people would choose this over the DM42. I'm already have a DM42 and am thinking about getting the DM41X after the beta is over but I wonder why someone would want this instead of the DM42.

...said the man that just bought a DM10L...

:D :D :D

Seriously: to me is the possibility to 'use' my preferred calc, 40 years after, in a sturdier, faster, most complete insteeliation.

[Gamo]

If the DM10L come with huge program space like 12C Platinum that
will be a good Scientific Programmable Calculator to have.

Gamo

[toml_12953]

(01-22-2020 10:48 AM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 06:28 AM)toml_12953 Wrote:  I'm curious as to why people would choose this over the DM42. I'm already have a DM42 and am thinking about getting the DM41X after the beta is over but I wonder why someone would want this instead of the DM42.

...said the man that just bought a DM10L...



Seriously: to me is the possibility to 'use' my preferred calc, 40 years after, in a sturdier, faster, most complete insteeliation.

Hell, I'll buy 'em all! SwissMicros is a great little company and I don't mind supporting them for all the support they give their customers. I was curious why a person would choose one over the other, though.

"insteeliation" I love it!

[kimwood]

Ordered my DM41x beta unit too. Also received the limited edition DM10L today - what a beauty! It completes my Voyager SwissMicros set. Highly recommended.

Regards,

Kim

[Massimo Gnerucci]

(01-22-2020 12:19 PM)toml_12953 Wrote:  Hell, I'll buy 'em all! SwissMicros is a great little company and I don't mind supporting them for all the support they give their customers.

I know, I know: I ordered the full set of CC at the time, after the first 2 15CC; then a DM41, a 42 and now the 41X. Just stayed away from the L series.
If the 41X will prove to be handy, I'll buy more.

They deserve to be encouraged and thanked for their dedication: where else to buy RPN calculators nowadays?

[Dave Britten]

(01-22-2020 06:28 AM)toml_12953 Wrote:  I'm curious as to why people would choose this over the DM42. I'm already have a DM42 and am thinking about getting the DM41X after the beta is over but I wonder why someone would want this instead of the DM42.

I think if you dig into the ecosystem of ROM modules, I/O, synthetic/m-code programming, extended memory and time functions, and so on, there's probably more that the 41 can do that the 42 can't than vice versa. So it boils down to personal preference for which one's distinguishing features you prefer.

I'm going to hold off until production units have been out for a while and see what the keyboard reviews are like. I got a first-batch production DM42, and I've never really liked the keyboard, despite lots of cleaning and loosening. Everything else about it is wonderful, but I've gone back to a 42S (with upgraded RAM) just for the better keyboard. If the DM41X turns out at least as good as the DM41L, I'd be okay with that; I think those models have pretty good keys, even if they aren't quite HP quality.

[jthole]

(01-22-2020 10:40 AM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:37 AM)jthole Wrote:  (and I love the DM41L) but I am allergic for a keyboard that doesn't feel right

This sentence contains an oxymoron.

Maybe ;-) but I once started with a HP 11C in university, so the landscape format doesn't feel wrong to me. I am also not a heavy DM41L user (mainly doing some conversion stuff, and some simple running related programs in there). I've been on the fence for a DM42 for a while, but using the Free42 and V41 emulators next to each other for some time convinced me that I prefer the straightforward user interface of the 41.

[jthole]

(01-22-2020 01:45 PM)Dave Britten Wrote:  If the DM41X turns out at least as good as the DM41L, I'd be okay with that; I think those models have pretty good keys, even if they aren't quite HP quality.

IMHO the DM41L and DM15L have excellent keys; I can use them blindly without the fear of missing a key press. The key feel is firmer than on my (worn out?) HP 11C indeed (and the few other HP calcs I have), but the key registration feels very reliable.

[Geoff Quickfall]

(01-22-2020 10:40 AM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 09:37 AM)jthole Wrote:  (and I love the DM41L) but I am allergic for a keyboard that doesn't feel right

This sentence contains an oxymoron.

Two parts oxygen and one part moron?

[Massimo Gnerucci]

(01-22-2020 02:24 PM)Geoff Quickfall Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 10:40 AM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  This sentence contains an oxymoron.

Two parts oxygen and one part moron?

[jthole]

(01-22-2020 02:24 PM)Geoff Quickfall Wrote:  Two parts oxygen and one part moron?

??

[Dave Britten]

(01-22-2020 02:24 PM)Geoff Quickfall Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 10:40 AM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  This sentence contains an oxymoron.

Two parts oxygen and one part moron?

You're thinking of moron dioxide.

[mfleming]

(01-22-2020 01:45 PM)Dave Britten Wrote:  I think if you dig into the ecosystem of ROM modules, I/O, synthetic/m-code programming, extended memory and time functions, and so on, there's probably more that the 41 can do that the 42 can't than vice versa. So it boils down to personal preference for which one's distinguishing features you prefer.

I'm going to hold off until production units have been out for a while and see what the keyboard reviews are like.

Your comment encapsulates some of the misgivings I have about the 41X. How does it go beyond the capabilities of a 41CL? Does the CPU have sufficient internal SRAM to implement four banks of 8 (preferably 12) I/O pages, plus extended memory? ALL of the register address space? Will there be a USB comm link to PyILPR to simulate external storage, printers, etc? That would be an enormous plus. Larger display - neat. USB drag & drop - neat. Pioneer shell & keyboard layout - hummm, so so. Not trying to harsh the vibe, but mark me skeptical until more feedback is available.

Looking forward to reading everyone's comments!

[Sylvain Cote]

(01-22-2020 04:01 PM)mfleming Wrote:  How does it go beyond the capabilities of a 41CL?

I have the same question. My DM41X has been shipped yesterday, so I should be able to start investigating next week.

(01-22-2020 04:01 PM)mfleming Wrote:  Does the CPU have sufficient internal SRAM to implement four banks of 8 (preferably 12) I/O pages, plus extended memory?
ALL of the register address space?

I assume that the it will run the standard or slightly modified 41XC ROM's, so my expectation is ... normal 41CX behavior.

(01-22-2020 04:01 PM)mfleming Wrote:  Will there be a USB comm link to PyILPR to simulate external storage, printers, etc?

Simulating HP-IL (82160A) behavior over USB and using the same frame format as the PIL-Box would be huge!
Il would integrate the calculator into the whole HP-IL physical and virtual ecosystem.
ex.1: DM41X -> USB -> HP-IL virtual softwares (pyILPER/ILPER/etc)
ex.2: DM41X -> USB -> PIL-Box -> HP-IL peripherals
The downer is that I am not expecting it.

(01-22-2020 04:01 PM)mfleming Wrote:  Larger display - neat.
USB drag & drop - neat.
Pioneer shell & keyboard layout - hummm, so so.

Agree, agree & agree.

[smp]

(01-22-2020 12:58 AM)Sylvain Cote Wrote:  The Beta Programme for the new SwissMicros DM41X calculator is now open! => Discussion Thread & Order Form

I just ordered mine.

Thanks very much for letting us know!
My order is in!

smp

[Dave Britten]

(01-22-2020 04:01 PM)mfleming Wrote:  

(01-22-2020 01:45 PM)Dave Britten Wrote:  I think if you dig into the ecosystem of ROM modules, I/O, synthetic/m-code programming, extended memory and time functions, and so on, there's probably more that the 41 can do that the 42 can't than vice versa. So it boils down to personal preference for which one's distinguishing features you prefer.

I'm going to hold off until production units have been out for a while and see what the keyboard reviews are like.

Your comment encapsulates some of the misgivings I have about the 41X. How does it go beyond the capabilities of a 41CL? Does the CPU have sufficient internal SRAM to implement four banks of 8 (preferably 12) I/O pages, plus extended memory? ALL of the register address space? Will there be a USB comm link to PyILPR to simulate external storage, printers, etc? That would be an enormous plus. Larger display - neat. USB drag & drop - neat. Pioneer shell & keyboard layout - hummm, so so. Not trying to harsh the vibe, but mark me skeptical until more feedback is available.

Looking forward to reading everyone's comments!

Right, you obviously won't be able to use real 41 modules or I/O like you can with a 41CL, so it remains to be seen what alternatives the DM41X provides and how they stack up to the other options. And in this regard, it could (and probably will) evolve over time. It will certainly be smaller, and more durable than 35-year-old plastic, at least.

I'm holding out to see if the keyboard and features make it worth getting, when I could just use my 41CX, or buy i41CX for my iPhone for about 10% the price.