RealCalc by Quartic Software UK

[MarkHaysHarris777]

Greetings,

I have been contemplating the inevitable demise of the dedicated hand-held calculator, particularly the beloved HP RPN non graphing variety. (My experience with the hand-held calcs goes back to the original HP35 and the original HP45 gold-key units which followed. I also own several Sharps and all of the TI advanced calcs. My most recent purchases for the collection are the FX115es Plus, TI 36x Pro, and the HP35s programable). Needless to say I'm a maths geek, a tech nerd... and I'm also a software engineer. I studied electrical engineering back in the 70's, and I'm an amateur radio operator W0MHH. May I say, I love my calculator collection and the idea of the dedicated hand-held units. Having said that, I am convinced that the age of the hand-held calculator (as such) is coming to an end... much like the slide rule before it (my slide rule is a Picket Dual-Base LogLog; my high school class '74 was the last class to teach the slide rule, and I used mine only briefly in college). sorry, I digressed there a bit...

The RPN calculator I carry with me and use on a daily basis is NOT a dedicated hand-held calc from my collection. I have been using an RPN calculator which may be configured to look and feel like an HP clone ( I have my x,y,z,t stack configured to show three lines, without buffer ), is a fully functional scientific calculator, and runs on my Android Samsung phone-- RealCalc from Quartic Software, UK.

It is my opinion that this new paradigm is the wave of the future in hand-held calculation. The calculator has been upgraded routinely (UI and firmware) and yet for me it was just a 1.5 minute software upgrade (no new purchase, no new hardware, no living with firmware glitches, etc). It has occurred to me that the HP paradigm (for which the new HP35s was released to celebrate) might be on the way out the door with the advent of the ARM processor and the smart phone. I just don't think HP can afford to compete any longer with cheaper education student models and certainly not with the smart phone software models.

See RealCalc here:

http://www.quartic-software.co.uk/screenshots.php

(if you configure the stack for HP style x,y,z,t then the 'Drop' key on these screen shots revert to the standard R arrow roll key)

I am wondering about a couple of things. What do you folks think about my thesis? Are any of you using smart phone RPN scientific calculator emulations rather than your dedicated hand-held? Do any of you foresee HP releasing another non graphing RPN calculator? Seems to me that the HP35s may be the last animal of its kind.

PS. For those of you who really loved the 15C, RealCalc running on the Android phone held sideways is pretty much an HP15C--- check it out.

[Paul Dale]

Get a WP 34S and feel the keys again.....

- Pauli

[MarkHaysHarris777]

(01-21-2015 06:58 AM)Paul Dale Wrote:  Get a WP 34S and feel the keys again.....

Actually, I *can* feel the keys on my Quartic RPN virtual HP calc...

The keys have a very nice tactile response (configurable) which is slightly audible and which actually vibrates the phone just enough that its *almost* like pressing an HP key ...

Although I wish there was just a little more travel in the keys of the HP35s, I do like the keyboard of that little jewel; very nice.

[MarkHaysHarris777]

(01-21-2015 06:58 AM)Paul Dale Wrote:  Get a WP 34S and feel the keys again.....

Pauli,
I have been interested in the WP34s for some time. When you first began the project I thought it was a joke (sorry) but I am impressed with how far y'all have come with it. I have not used either of the 30b or 20b models... and having not handled a repurposed unit yet I'm not sure how the overlay works, which model the overlay works best on, nor whether there is really any significant difference between the keys of the 30b vs the 20b.
I would not mind trying it out. Have you guys made any more progress on an Android version (QT?) that might run on my phone?
I use gnu/linux exclusively these days; so, if the flashing software only runs on windows I won't be doing it (don't flirt with windows any more, she's history).
Do you guys pre-flash the WP34s?
Is there gnu/linux flashing software? Will flashing software run in wine?

Thanks again for the reminder on the WP34s... its really a cool community project... very proud of you guys. I'll give it some more thought... but I'm still very interested in the virtual RPN idea and whether that is going to get some steam in your opinion. I realize that your emphasis is going to be on the WP34s and for good reason.

nice to meet you, Pauli.

Cheers

[walter b]

(01-21-2015 08:13 AM)MarkHaysHarris777 Wrote:  I have been interested in the WP34s for some time. When you first began the project I thought it was a joke (sorry) but I am impressed with how far y'all have come with it. I have not used either of the 30b or 20b models... and having not handled a repurposed unit yet I'm not sure how the overlay works, which model the overlay works best on, nor whether there is really any significant difference between the keys of the 30b vs the 20b.

Please let me quote from p. 3 of the WP 34S manual:

"WP 34S runs on an HP 30b Business Professional, a financial pocket calculator available for less than 40 US$ today. It also runs on an HP-20b but we recommend the HP 30b for its better keyboard. So get hold of one of them. Then turn to Appendix A of this manual for instructions how to convert it into a full-fledged WP 34S yourself – it may be a rewarding experience.
On the other hand, you can purchase a WP 34S readily on the internet; see e.g.
• http://commerce.hpcalc.org/34s.php (shipping from the USA) or
• http://www.thecalculatorstore.com/epages...%20Pack%22 (shipping from Spain).
The first way (converting it yourself) will cost you little money plus some time, the second will cost you significantly more money and less time. If you choose buying your WP 34S at one of those two sites, we (the developers) will get a very modest fraction of the price to support our otherwise unpaid efforts on the WP 34S project. Either way will work – it is your choice."

Quote: I would not mind trying it out. Have you guys made any more progress on an Android version (QT?) that might run on my phone?

AFAIK, there's no WP 34S emulator running on Android phones yet. That's Pascal's realm.

Quote: Do you guys pre-flash the WP34s?

No, we don't. Please see above.

Quote: Thanks again for the reminder on the WP34s... its really a cool community project... very proud of you guys. I'll give it some more thought... but I'm still very interested in the virtual RPN idea and whether that is going to get some steam in your opinion. I realize that your emphasis is going to be on the WP34s and for good reason.

Thanks for your kind words. Our emphasis is on real calculators (i.e. ones with real keys ). We continue supporting the WP 34S and WP 31S but we're anxiously waiting for the 43S prototypes.

d:-)

[Gerald H]

Yes, Realcalc is a pleasant calculator app - I recommend the paid for version, the additional precision enhances comfort & developpers need to be supported.

The great disadvantage vis a vis a real calculator remains battery life.

[Bit]

(01-21-2015 07:42 AM)MarkHaysHarris777 Wrote:  

(01-21-2015 06:58 AM)Paul Dale Wrote:  Get a WP 34S and feel the keys again.....

Actually, I *can* feel the keys on my Quartic RPN virtual HP calc...

The keys have a very nice tactile response (configurable) which is slightly audible and which actually vibrates the phone just enough that its *almost* like pressing an HP key ...

That doesn't help your finger easily find the key you want to press. Touchscreens are clearly inferior as an input device for most tasks in my opinion, especially if the task involves some complicated interaction. It's of course a huge advantage that they can be instantly 'reconfigured' to any layout, and it makes them a good trade-off in many cases.

I, too, have RPN calculator programs on my cell phone, including RealCalc, and they're very useful whenever I don't have another device (a WP 34S or a computer) at hand. But I would never use a phone calculator instead of something with buttons if I have a choice.

[Bit]

(01-21-2015 08:13 AM)MarkHaysHarris777 Wrote:  

(01-21-2015 06:58 AM)Paul Dale Wrote:  Get a WP 34S and feel the keys again.....

Pauli,
I have been interested in the WP34s for some time. When you first began the project I thought it was a joke (sorry) but I am impressed with how far y'all have come with it. I have not used either of the 30b or 20b models... and having not handled a repurposed unit yet I'm not sure how the overlay works, which model the overlay works best on, nor whether there is really any significant difference between the keys of the 30b vs the 20b.
I would not mind trying it out. Have you guys made any more progress on an Android version (QT?) that might run on my phone?
I use gnu/linux exclusively these days; so, if the flashing software only runs on windows I won't be doing it (don't flirt with windows any more, she's history).
Do you guys pre-flash the WP34s?
Is there gnu/linux flashing software? Will flashing software run in wine?

Thanks again for the reminder on the WP34s... its really a cool community project... very proud of you guys. I'll give it some more thought... but I'm still very interested in the virtual RPN idea and whether that is going to get some steam in your opinion. I realize that your emphasis is going to be on the WP34s and for good reason.

nice to meet you, Pauli.

Cheers

I ordered from hpcalc.org that Walter mentioned and I can confirm that you receive a nicely finished product. I've also created several WP 34S and 31S devices myself. If you have a steady hand and lots of patience, it's not at all difficult, but not everyone is cut out for that job.

Flashing on Linux works well with MySamba.

The Windows version of the emulator works well under Wine but I see no reason to use that instead of the native Qt emulator. If you'd like to compile the Qt emulator, you'll need the standard Qt development tools and libraries, there's no trick to be aware of.

If you'd like to build the flash image on Linux, you should install the Yagarto 4.6.0 toolchain under Wine (it's a Windows package). That's the only compiler that's currently known not to miscompile the flash image. Other versions and builds of GCC often cause problems. Those problems can be quite subtle and may not be easy to notice quickly, so you really don't want to go there unless you want to debug compiler bugs. I've created tiny scripts to invoke the Yagarto tools through Wine as if they were native Linux binaries so 'make' just works. I recommend you do the same.

However, starting up Wine has a lot of overhead, which makes compiling the library with the constants slow because that involves invoking GCC very many times to compile small files one by one. I also have a native CodeSourcery ARM GCC toolchain installed in my Linux development environment and I modify compile_consts.c before every build to invoke the native GCC only for the constants, it speeds up the process greatly. I have verified that the constants aren't miscompiled (it's only data, there's no code in those modules).

If you'd like to get involved in the development, I suggest you first check out features.h to see the compile time options already available. My builds and patches can also give you an idea of what's possible with the code base. If you have further questions related to using these things on Linux, I'm happy to help.

[MarkHaysHarris777]

(01-21-2015 05:53 PM)Bit Wrote:  I ordered from hpcalc.org that Walter mentioned and I can confirm that you receive a nicely finished product. I've also created several WP 34S and 31S devices myself. If you have a steady hand and lots of patience, it's not at all difficult, but not everyone is cut out for that job.

Thanks for the info... I too have done mods work (not calculator related) and I have the skill set [have soldering iron will travel] but frankly I was more concerned about the flash the 30b. Those things can be picked up for $14.00 plus shipping so I guess if I brick it there no big loss. hihi :-} It might be fun to try it out.
I appreciate the info regarding MySamba and wine. I'm noticing there might be some options for mac flashing? I have access to a mac (I dual boot the mini with Mint and Snow Leopard). Also, I don't have the cable. So I'm tempted to order the product on the one hand though I'm also challenged to try it myself just because!
Thanks again, for the offer of help. 'preciate it! Good to meet you!

[Dave Frederickson]

Oliver De Smet has a very nice collection of HP emulators for Android. On my phone I have 15CSciCalc by APTOiDE and, of course, Free42.

[MarkHaysHarris777]

(01-21-2015 08:07 PM)Dave Frederickson Wrote:  Oliver De Smet has a very nice collection of HP emulators for Android. On my phone I have 15CSciCalc by APTOiD and, of course, Free42.

Thanks much, that's what I was looking for! 'preciate it...

[nicklucas]

(01-21-2015 08:07 PM)Dave Frederickson Wrote:  Oliver De Smet has a very nice collection of HP emulators for Android. On my phone I have 15CSciCalc by APTOiDE and, of course, Free42.

Thanks mate! You are life savior! I have been searching for this on google and finally landed on this thread.