Next Generation Calculator

[Steve Simpkin]

For engineering (and probably science) applications I don't think that "calculations" are now being done very often using "calculators" on phones, tablets and laptops. In my experience manual "calculations" of any kind are just not needed as often. When I started as an electrical engineer in the 80's I had to manually calculate the value of almost every resistor, capacitor and inductor in the analog circuitry I designed. Even with digital circuits I had to calculate many timing values. I did these calculations manually well into the 90's using a series of ever more powerful HP calculators. Over time the need for manual calculations gradually decreased. Specialized computer aided design software, spreadsheets and the "typical" application schematics contained in device datasheets all but eliminated the need to manually calculate the values of anything using a calculator. In my opinion, these changes in the engineering profession and the newer tools that have evolved have mostly eliminated the need for a physical calculator in this role. For myself, I will still go out of my way to find an excuse to use my HP-48SX to do a quick calculation but I can't imagine someone younger who didn't have to use a calculator as a required engineering tool needing one.

[smartin]

(11-28-2020 08:47 PM)Garth Wilson Wrote:  SwissMicros is what we have now.

Based on my experience with only their latest product, the DM41X, I would say SwissMicros is a very worthy successor!

A big thanks to the SwissMicros team and the long time HP users on this forum who aided in its development.

-Steve

[jthole]

(11-29-2020 09:44 PM)smartin Wrote:  Based on my experience with only their latest product, the DM41X, I would say SwissMicros is a very worthy successor!

A big thanks to the SwissMicros team and the long time HP users on this forum who aided in its development.

-Steve

What I heard is that they finally conquered the long lasting keyboard problems. If it turns out that the latest DMs have long lasting reliable keyboards indeed, then they surely are a worthy successor!

And their calculators may be expensive compared to the few remaining offerings from HP, TI, and Casio, but they are not overpriced. My HP 11C was very expensive as well, but still works flawlessly after 35 years (even with a dented keyboard; my own fault unfortunately). Even if a DM41X would last only ten years, it would still be a good buy (for me). And I would expect it to last much longer.

I am just waiting for longer term reports of the new keyboards; the only weak spot of the previous DM models.

[Thomas Okken]

Even with HP dropping out of the game, I expect calculators will never disappear completely. The hand-held form factor is still useful in places like construction sites, surveying, cockpits, and probably others. It looks like it will just be served mostly by smartphone apps, with small specialized companies like SwissMicros catering to those who really want or need a physical keyboard.

Smartphones sure do make a compelling platform. They are so fast! Not long ago I ran a few Free42 benchmarks and was amazed that they ran faster on my phone than on my laptop. Granted that my phone is a few years newer, that's still pretty impressive. The difference between phones and laptops is mostly about human I/O nowadays... I can't see custom-built calculators ever keeping up with that in terms of raw performance.

[Maximilian Hohmann]

Hello!

(11-30-2020 12:50 PM)Thomas Okken Wrote:  ... cockpits, and probably others. It looks like it will just be served mostly by smartphone apps, with small specialized companies like SwissMicros catering to those who really want or need a physical keyboard.

I think that in my company I am the only one who uses a real calculator in the cockpit. Everybody else has been using his phone for at least a decade. And I too use the phone when it gets dark. Because I can still read it without turning up a light and placing the calculator underneath it.

And regarding the keyboard feel: Newer smartphones can produce a little tactile "buzz" when (virtual) keys are pressed. I actually prefer that over a real key click, because some real keys click without actually registering (especially some of the older models in my collection) whereas the phone's tactile feedback is only given if the keypress has been registered. Much better!

Regards
Max

[Thomas Okken]

(11-30-2020 01:17 PM)Maximilian Hohmann Wrote:  Newer smartphones can produce a little tactile "buzz" when (virtual) keys are pressed.

Android smartphones have had that ability since forever... like my 2010 HTC Aria running Android 2.2... iPhones were late to the party but they've had haptic feedback starting with (I think) the iPhone 7.

[John Keith]

(11-30-2020 12:50 PM)Thomas Okken Wrote:  Smartphones sure do make a compelling platform. They are so fast! Not long ago I ran a few Free42 benchmarks and was amazed that they ran faster on my phone than on my laptop.

This is true for me as well, for both Free42 and EMU48. I am using the emulators more often than the physical calculators these days, both for speed and convenience.

I prefer the keyboard click of Free42 to the haptic feedback of EMU48 but both go a long way toward making the cellular phone a viable replacement for the physical calculator.

That being said, I still want a DM48!

[Valentin Albillo]

.
Hi, Thomas:

Thomas Okken Wrote:Smartphones sure do make a compelling platform. They are so fast! Not long ago I ran a few Free42 benchmarks and was amazed that they ran faster on my phone than on my laptop.

However, in the timings you recently sent me featuring Free42 running a benchmark of yours in assorted devices, we had, amongst others:

      Free42 Decimal, on iPhone 8 (2.39 GHz, 64-bit ARM):     4,800x faster than HP-42S
      Free42 Decimal, on MacBook Air (1.6 GHz, i5)      :    24,400x
      Free42 Binary,  on MacBook Air (1.6 GHz, i5)      :   220,000x

so that particular laptop was 5x faster (not slower) than that particular phone, not to mention Free42 Binary, which was almost 46x faster.

Best regards.
V.

[Artur - Brasil]

Interesting to see that almost all comments tend to say the calculators are dead.
But there is at least three new fronts, WP RPN calculators, Swiss Micros and the https://www.numworks.com as independent players on the market.

Best regads
Artur

[smartin]

(11-30-2020 07:34 AM)jthole Wrote:  

(11-29-2020 09:44 PM)smartin Wrote:  Based on my experience with only their latest product, the DM41X, I would say SwissMicros is a very worthy successor!

A big thanks to the SwissMicros team and the long time HP users on this forum who aided in its development.

-Steve

What I heard is that they finally conquered the long lasting keyboard problems. If it turns out that the latest DMs have long lasting reliable keyboards indeed, then they surely are a worthy successor!

And their calculators may be expensive compared to the few remaining offerings from HP, TI, and Casio, but they are not overpriced. My HP 11C was very expensive as well, but still works flawlessly after 35 years (even with a dented keyboard; my own fault unfortunately). Even if a DM41X would last only ten years, it would still be a good buy (for me). And I would expect it to last much longer.

I am just waiting for longer term reports of the new keyboards; the only weak spot of the previous DM models.

I have a production version of the DM41X. The keys have positive feedback and a very definitive click sound. I have not had any missed key presses. The keys are stiffer and louder compared to an original HP 41CV or 41CX. I prefer the softer and quieter keys on an original 41CV or 41CX, but that could be because I have used the 41CV for so long and I'm used to it. Also, we should not expect keys that behave exactly like an original 41CX (if for no other reason than the hardware is different). That being said, after using the DM41X for several weeks, I have nothing bad to say about the keys and find the keyboard fine in daily use.

The enhancements on the DM41X compared to an original 41CX make for a truely amazing machine. My favorite additions:

* Screen is beautiful with three different display modes. In terms of readability, I would put the digit display rendition on the DM41X right in between a 41CV and a 41CX (the latter had segments not quite as tightly packed as the 41CV).

* Ability to display multiple steps on the screen in program mode.

* A very functional key assignment menu.

* Interface to a computer via USB for moving programs back and forth.

* Some very nice function additions to the original CX ROM set by Angel Martin.

* And, of course, the ability to load many many ROM modules (I just love the ROM map screen).

Steve

[Sukiari]

(11-28-2020 08:47 PM)Garth Wilson Wrote:  SwissMicros is what we have now.

This, and it’s fine. Here’s hoping that NewRPL is noticed by Michael.

[MNH]

(11-28-2020 08:47 PM)Garth Wilson Wrote:  SwissMicros is what we have now.

Any possibility that a future DM48 would come with Bluetooth? Would SysRPL be available?

[grsbanks]

This is all purely hypothetical because, to the best of my knowledge, there are no plans to make a clone of any of the 48/49/50 series.

[Massimo Gnerucci]

(12-12-2020 02:45 PM)grsbanks Wrote:  This is all purely hypothetical because, to the best of my knowledge, there are no plans to make a clone of any of the 48/49/50 series.

Gaudeamus igitur.

[Mark Hardman]

(12-12-2020 02:47 PM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  

(12-12-2020 02:45 PM)grsbanks Wrote:  This is all purely hypothetical because, to the best of my knowledge, there are no plans to make a clone of any of the 48/49/50 series.

Gaudeamus igitur.

And to quote the 3rd verse:

Vita nostra brevis est
Brevi finietur.
Venit mors velociter
Rapit nos atrociter
Nemini parcetur.

[Marco Polo]

(12-12-2020 02:45 PM)grsbanks Wrote:  This is all purely hypothetical because, to the best of my knowledge, there are no plans to make a clone of any of the 48/49/50 series.

Time preserve my 48gx+128kb+1mb cards and to get an additional spare 50g (it would be the 2nd spare...) ?
:-)

[Massimo Gnerucci]

(12-12-2020 03:28 PM)Mark Hardman Wrote:  

(12-12-2020 02:47 PM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  Gaudeamus igitur.

And to quote the 3rd verse:

Vita nostra brevis est
Brevi finietur.
Venit mors velociter
Rapit nos atrociter
Nemini parcetur.

Terque quaterque testicula tacta omnia mala fugat

Me paenitet

[Mark Hardman]

(12-12-2020 03:56 PM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  

(12-12-2020 03:28 PM)Mark Hardman Wrote:  And to quote the 3rd verse:

Vita nostra brevis est
Brevi finietur.
Venit mors velociter
Rapit nos atrociter
Nemini parcetur.

Terque quaterque testicula tacta omnia mala fugat

Me paenitet

Apologies accepted.

[rprosperi]

(12-12-2020 03:56 PM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  Terque quaterque testicula tacta omnia mala fugat

Me paenitet

Google translates as:

And four times the testicles, were struck by lightning three times she tried to flight all the evils of.

I assume something is missing there... at least I hope so...

[Massimo Gnerucci]

(12-12-2020 08:07 PM)rprosperi Wrote:  

(12-12-2020 03:56 PM)Massimo Gnerucci Wrote:  Terque quaterque testicula tacta omnia mala fugat

Me paenitet

Google translates as:

And four times the testicles, were struck by lightning three times she tried to flight all the evils of.

I assume something is missing there... at least I hope so...

more or less:
The testicles touched three and four times chase away all evil

I'm sorry

But your version is funnier!