DM32 from Swiss Micros

[Namir]

Swiss Micros are taking pre-orders for the upcoming DM32 the HP-32SII clone!

Namir

[Steve Simpkin]

Here is a link to the DM32 product page.
https://www.swissmicros.com/product/model-dm32

[polbit]

That price, CHF 20 more than DM42, is simply nuts...

[pascal_meheut]

(05-17-2023 04:26 AM)polbit Wrote:  That price, CHF 20 more than DM42, is simply nuts...

Unless they are selling the DM42 based on the price of the last batch they got from the factory and they could not get such a good deal for the DM32. Lower volumes, inflation...

[sjthomas]

(05-17-2023 04:26 AM)polbit Wrote:  That price, CHF 20 more than DM42, is simply nuts...

Agreed. With shipping that's almost US$300!!

[Eric Rechlin]

The DM32 is on newer, more advanced hardware than the DM42, so a price increase isn't too surprising. It's the same price as the DM41X, which is still on the older hardware.

I preordered one. Hope I don't regret it...wish I could have preordered back in October when the dollar was 10% stronger!

[TallKey]

(05-17-2023 04:26 AM)polbit Wrote:  That price, CHF 20 more than DM42, is simply nuts...

USB C tax? Not being serious about the question, but it a positive change from the silliness of micro USB ports on the other SM offerings.

41X is 20 CHF higher today than some months ago.

Glad to see production of the retro-like handheld offerings from SM (anyone really).

[Marco Polo]

Frankly speaking the price is far too high.
The hardware seems very good, i suppose quality will be very high.
But, all in all it has more or less the same functionality and limitations of my 35s, I am not going to pay 255 Eur (as per today exchange rate) when I can get DM42 for the same money or a 48g/II or a 50g in good shape for about one half of the price.
The above considering the calculator to be used for professional purpose.
Just my 2 cents.

[FLISZT]

Of course, the DM32 has a new hardware architecture (160 MHz processor, etc.)... but is this the reason for the high price of the DM32 (versus the capabilities of the 41X/42)?

Is the DM41X/42 processor at the end of its availability?
If so, then the price of the DM41X and DM42 could increase significantly.

[jonmoore]

(05-17-2023 06:16 AM)FLISZT Wrote:  Of course, the DM32 has a new hardware architecture (160 MHz processor, etc.)... but is this the reason for the high price of the DM32 (versus the capabilities of the 41X/42)?

Is the DM41X/42 processor at the end of its availability?
If so, then the price of the DM41X and DM42 could increase significantly.

Whilst the DM32 has the new low power Cortex M33 processor, I did notice the careful wording of "at max" 160 MHz. I'd love to know what speed the processor runs at when optimized for low power (typical everyday use).

Given that the core market for both the HP32 S/Sii was students (that didn't require the significantly more powerful HP-42s), the pricing does seem strange, to say the least.

To make sure my memory wasn't playing tricks I checked the pricing of the 42 vs the 32 in the Educalc catalog of spring 91. This seemed like a good point in time seeing as the 48 wasn't as yet available (but the 28S was), and the advertising at that point in time showed a healthy difference between the street and list pricing.

Long story short, the 42S list price was $120 and the 32Sii was $70. That's an approximate 42% discount for the 32Sii over the 42S. The street price was significantly less in both cases, as can be seen in the advertisements but the pricing difference between the models was still close to 40%.

The most telling aspect of the advertising for me was that the 32 had a mixed fraction on it's display, which alluded to high school curriculum capabilities.

I own both a HP-32S and HP-32Sii, but had convinced myself that I'd purchase a DM32, but only if it were priced appropriately. CHF: 249 is far too high a price for the calculators capabilities when compared to the DM42 and DM41X. The whole point of the HP-32II was that it most often appealed to those that where less interested in exhaustive programming features, but rather were looking for a simple yet powerful calculator where the vast majority of functions were available without menu diving.

I'm fully aware of the hardware advantages offered by the DM32, but as I understand things, the hardware platform will eventually power all SwissMicros premium models. This makes economic sense as a single hardware platform for a low volume product will often be more profitable than attempting to source separate components for a range of similar products. HP wrote the book regarding this supply chain strategy (but quite obviously with far higher sales volumes).

Marketing 101 says you should derive your pricing strategy based on market drivers, rather than own supply chain needs.

Ultimately, the market will decide if CHF: 249 is too high for a student calculator. But at this price, it appears that SwissMicros have already decided that the DM32 is a niche product that will mainly appeal to nostalgic collectors willing to pay a premium.

[Jeff_Birt]

You can't compare relative pricing 40 years ago to today. You can't even compare pricing of two years ago to today. Over the past few years component pricing has risen 25% to more than 250% (if you can even get the parts). A rule of thumb for product pricing is to take component pricing and multiply by 3. By the time you account for parts, production, clerical and overhead this works out to be a fair pricing estimate.

For all of you complaining about the pricing remember SM is selling niche, low volume, products. They are also not a Chinese knock off factory.

[Dave Britten]

I'm probably going to wait for some glowing reviews on this one. The 41X hasn't had a firmware update in over 2 years, and it still has some lingering bugs and missing features (e.g. ability to easily import/export extended memory files). I want to be sure this doesn't have any issues that go unfixed and make this more of a DM35S than a DM32.

[jonmoore]

(05-17-2023 12:17 PM)Jeff_Birt Wrote:  For all of you complaining about the pricing remember SM is selling niche, low volume, products. They are also not a Chinese knock off factory.

If you read my comments in the other DM32 related thread, you'll see that my pricing strategy feedback centers on a belief that SM are doing themselves a disservice. At the right price, the DM32 could appeal to contemporary students. Primarily those aged 16-18 that are looking for an alternative to the Prime, which isn't well regarded in the UK education sector because of it's CAS capabilities (even with it's exam mode). Staying with the UK sector, at it's what I know, students in this age bracket are also looking for a more grown up calculator than the Casio options they have thrust upon them as the 'officially' approved option.

The 32Sii was a success back in the day because it answered a real need. Surely SwissMicros could move beyond creating hardware for a diminishing audience of passionate nostalgics. The DM42 managed to crossover to a more general audience and I don't see why the DM32 couldn't also succeed as a crossover product for SwissMicros. Part of the reason for the success of the DM42 was that it had what branding experts define as a "single minded proposition" - that being that that it was the worlds most precise handheld calculator. We all know that it's a whole lot more than that, But well defined single minded propositions connect with consumers.

The success of the DM42 as a crossover product was also helped by the ever increasing price of the 42S on auction sites, which was on average more than the price of the superior DM42. Here in the UK 32Sii's and 32s's sell at an average of £80 to £110. That means that the DM32 is more than twice the price of the HP original. You might see opportunists listing their HP 32's a ridiculous asking prices but actual sales tend to achieve more realistic amounts.

https://www.amazon.com/DM42-the-most-pre...B07B4W13GW

[jonmoore]

And talking of opportunists!

[Eric Rechlin]

The cost of the LCD alone in the DM32 makes it impossible to sell it for a price competitive to other high-end student calculators (you could buy an entire HP 10bII+ for less than the price of the DM32 LCD). SwissMicros is not trying to compete in that market, and there's no way they even could unless they downgraded to a much cheaper display. This is a very niche product with very high end components and has an appropriate price for what it is. There is really no competition for it -- it only exists for people who fondly remember old HP calculators and want something to add to that experience. This is not going to be anyone's first calculator or even their second; I suspect the average DM32 buyer already has 10+ calculators.

[jonmoore]

(05-17-2023 06:50 PM)Eric Rechlin Wrote:  This is not going to be anyone's first calculator or even their second; I suspect the average DM32 buyer already has 10+ calculators.

I own a DM42 and a DM41X, and yep, more than 10 other calculators, so guilty as charged.

[Siegfried]

(05-17-2023 03:36 PM)jonmoore Wrote:  At the right price, the DM32 could appeal to contemporary students. Primarily those aged 16-18 that are looking for an alternative to the Prime, which isn't well regarded in the UK education sector because of it's CAS capabilities (even with it's exam mode). Staying with the UK sector, at it's what I know, students in this age bracket are also looking for a more grown up calculator than the Casio options they have thrust upon them as the 'officially' approved option.

I doubt that would be the case at even half the price. Both my sons had good grades in math, one of them programmed quite a lot (1980s BASIC to C++) and both did not shy away from logical challenges, but both of them politely refused all RPN offers and considered their TI-30Xs sufficient for their purposes and more comfortable to use (probably because you can see the whole calculation while you type). For my youngest it isn't even sure they will use classroom calculators at all, having been issued laptops.

[jonmoore]

(05-17-2023 09:17 PM)Siegfried Wrote:  I doubt that would be the case at even half the price. Both my sons had good grades in math, one of them programmed quite a lot (1980s BASIC to C++) and both did not shy away from logical challenges, but both of them politely refused all RPN offers and considered their TI-30Xs sufficient for their purposes and more comfortable to use (probably because you can see the whole calculation while you type). For my youngest it isn't even sure they will use classroom calculators at all, having been issued laptops.

We should swap kids. Mine keep on pilfering from my collection.

[FLISZT]

Hello,

Does anyone know why SwissMicros did not keep the hardware platform used on the DM41X / 42?

Wasn't it good enough? Availability problem in the short or medium term?

SwissMicros is in a niche market. Its price is likely to place it in the "niche of the niche", if I may say so.
A product must meet its customers. I hope that this will be the case with the DM32.
I don't know what SM's sales targets are, but obviously, opinions are divided because of the price.

Anyway, I find it « jolie ».
(with an "e" for the female agreement)



Best regards

[KCC]

Totally agreed. So with the original HP32SII a 42% discount over HP42S, if the price of the DM32 has 42% discount over DM42, i.e. ~CHF 133, ordering one, or even two will be a no brainer.

(05-17-2023 09:18 AM)jonmoore Wrote:  

(05-17-2023 06:16 AM)FLISZT Wrote:  Of course, the DM32 has a new hardware architecture (160 MHz processor, etc.)... but is this the reason for the high price of the DM32 (versus the capabilities of the 41X/42)?

Is the DM41X/42 processor at the end of its availability?
If so, then the price of the DM41X and DM42 could increase significantly.

Whilst the DM32 has the new low power Cortex M33 processor, I did notice the careful wording of "at max" 160 MHz. I'd love to know what speed the processor runs at when optimized for low power (typical everyday use).

Given that the core market for both the HP32 S/Sii was students (that didn't require the significantly more powerful HP-42s), the pricing does seem strange, to say the least.

To make sure my memory wasn't playing tricks I checked the pricing of the 42 vs the 32 in the Educalc catalog of spring 91. This seemed like a good point in time seeing as the 48 wasn't as yet available (but the 28S was), and the advertising at that point in time showed a healthy difference between the street and list pricing.

Long story short, the 42S list price was $120 and the 32Sii was $70. That's an approximate 42% discount for the 32Sii over the 42S. The street price was significantly less in both cases, as can be seen in the advertisements but the pricing difference between the models was still close to 40%.

The most telling aspect of the advertising for me was that the 32 had a mixed fraction on it's display, which alluded to high school curriculum capabilities.

I own both a HP-32S and HP-32Sii, but had convinced myself that I'd purchase a DM32, but only if it were priced appropriately. CHF: 249 is far too high a price for the calculators capabilities when compared to the DM42 and DM41X. The whole point of the HP-32II was that it most often appealed to those that where less interested in exhaustive programming features, but rather were looking for a simple yet powerful calculator where the vast majority of functions were available without menu diving.

I'm fully aware of the hardware advantages offered by the DM32, but as I understand things, the hardware platform will eventually power all SwissMicros premium models. This makes economic sense as a single hardware platform for a low volume product will often be more profitable than attempting to source separate components for a range of similar products. HP wrote the book regarding this supply chain strategy (but quite obviously with far higher sales volumes).

Marketing 101 says you should derive your pricing strategy based on market drivers, rather than own supply chain needs.

Ultimately, the market will decide if CHF: 249 is too high for a student calculator. But at this price, it appears that SwissMicros have already decided that the DM32 is a niche product that will mainly appeal to nostalgic collectors willing to pay a premium.