Public Beta Availiable - Win/Mac/Firmware [UPDATED]

[Arno K]

In English there is the same problem.
Arno

[webmasterpdx]

(11-10-2017 04:26 PM)Tim Wessman Wrote:  

(11-10-2017 07:02 AM)webmasterpdx Wrote:  In Graph3D, I want to suggest you add a parameter to increase contrast in shading on curved surfaces.

Have you changed your surface shading options? Either press the menu key or go into plot setup page 2/3. Does none of that do what you are looking for?

The menu key only shows me zoom options....nothing related to shading.
I didn't see anything related to surface shading in the settings. There is the drawing method (checkerboard, etc..).. but I wanted to keep the drawing method and change the extent of shading, as certain surfaces like a wide conic (where the curve is very gradual) is often difficult to see (looks like a triangle instead of a cone, as there isn't enough contrast between darkest and lightest spot).
??

[webmasterpdx]

(11-10-2017 09:47 AM)salvomic Wrote:  

(11-10-2017 04:26 AM)webmasterpdx Wrote:  Also, I'm not sure that putting the user functions in the catalog is of any use. ...

<snip>

I've about 250 custom programs, and the Catalog is still fast enough, without perceptible slowing down.

<snip>

Salvo

I wasn't referring to the actual speed of the catalog, but the time it takes me to find my function. e.g. If I'm looking for a function that I can't quite remember the name of or want to enter it via the catalog (usually faster than typing), so lets say "trigcos" as an example. So, I hit catalog-t-r, and lets say I've loaded a useful math library into my programs (maybe I didn't write it, or maybe I did), and it has 50 functions beginning with tr, now I have to scroll down 5 pages to find trigcos....much slower...

Also, that math library could be accessed via User-libname-trwhatever.

[webmasterpdx]

Possible bugs in graph3d.

First, the Autoscale zoom option seems to always give the ! reply.

Second....

If you try to plot a half a sphere using:

FZ1=sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2))

This should be a sphere of radius 4. You'll notice these extreme jaggies as it gets close to the plane z=0. At first, I thought it might just be rounding errors, but if you use a radius of 10, you can see the blank areas are much taller in the z direction than 1, which means it's not rounding error. It should be flush with the plane z=0.

Try plotting the following:

FZ1=sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2))

FZ2=0

That'll plot the semi-sphere and the plane, which gives the following (the semi-sphere should be flush with the plane)...

   

[Arno K]

(11-11-2017 12:26 PM)webmasterpdx Wrote:  Possible bugs in graph3d.

First, the Autoscale zoom option seems to always give the ! reply.

Second....

If you try to plot a half a sphere using:

FZ1=sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2))

This should be a sphere of radius 4. You'll notice these extreme jaggies as it gets close to the plane z=0. At first, I thought it might just be rounding errors, but if you use a radius of 10, you can see the blank areas are much taller in the z direction than 1, which means it's not rounding error. It should be flush with the plane z=0.

Try plotting the following:

FZ1=sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2))

FZ2=0

That'll plot the semi-sphere and the plane, which gives the following (the semi-sphere should be flush with the plane)...

Perhaps that has to do with the TRIANGLE command, but Wofram Alpha doesn't do much better. for that reason I requested a parametric-3d plot some time ago.
Arno

[Anders]

(11-11-2017 12:26 PM)webmasterpdx Wrote:  Possible bugs in graph3d.

First, the Autoscale zoom option seems to always give the ! reply.

Second....

If you try to plot a half a sphere using:

FZ1=sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2))

This should be a sphere of radius 4. You'll notice these extreme jaggies as it gets close to the plane z=0. At first, I thought it might just be rounding errors, but if you use a radius of 10, you can see the blank areas are much taller in the z direction than 1, which means it's not rounding error. It should be flush with the plane z=0.

Try plotting the following:

FZ1=sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2))

FZ2=0

That'll plot the semi-sphere and the plane, which gives the following (the semi-sphere should be flush with the plane)...

confirmed. I get the same.
If you add FZ2=-sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2)) you should get a complete sphere (two halvs each in a different color) and you see the error more clearly.

e.g. approaching the Y=-4 plan the sphere shows a "perfect" circular hole with radius approximately = 1.2 "ish".
The app is drawing lots circles at increasing/decreasing diameters to create the 3D object. you can clearly see the beginning of several circles centered around the Z=0 plane from both x and the y direction.


It also does not matter if you change the Num X Step and NUM Y Step to something smaller say 0.0000001 because that is in the Graph 3D Num Set Up screens. Nor does it change if you use the x^0.5 function instead => it is in the app not in the sqrt function

I think what happens is that the 16-(X^2+Y^2) eventually becomes negative as the algorithm increases X and Y with a step dx,dy so when the next X=X+dx and next Y=Y+dy evaluated: Z(X+dx,Y+dy) fails, (because sqrt(negative value)) the plot functions simply terminates. What the plot function should do, is use smaller and smaller steps to keep 16-(X^2+Y^2) >=0 until no hole is no longer visible and then terminate.

Conclusion:

The Plot X and Y Steps are simply too large drawing each circle or point creating holes in the Z plane.
Since the Graph 3D Num Set Up step values have no effect the Plot step, maybe you (HP) need to add Plot X Step and Plot Y Step parameters on one of the Graph 3D Plot Set Up screens so the user have more control.

Alternatively (as an option introduce a tick mark on one of the Graph 3D Plot Set Up screens) automate plot step adaptively:
If the delta between two plot points: Z(x+dx,y+dy) - Z(x,y) is > smallest visible "hole" or if Z(x+dx,y+dy) leads to an error (in the case of sqrt() above), given the scale parameters, then half the step (dx and dy) in each direction x,y (independently based on your plot algorithm) and evaluate again. Repeat until Z(x+dx,y+dy) - Z(x,y) < smallest visible "hole" size (However, not beyond an allowed Min step size to avoid local singularities when Z-> infinity and get to termination). When true, plot Z(x+dx,y+dy) (again: you need to evaluate Z-deltas in the x and y direction independently as we are not always going to have a symmetric body). Similarly, to speed up the algorithm, you need to adaptively increase the step size if the Z(x+dx,y+dy) - Z(x,y) starts to get to small too small to show on the plot... (say as Z approaches 4 and -4 in the this example). However, not beyond a max step size (again to limit the risk of jumping over local singularities or anomalies).

[Mic]

Absolutly great ! Definitevely the BEST calculator ever ! All stores, teachers, fathers and students have to understand now

2 small videos showing 3D graphing and tabvar use in action :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CWI1TRlUqGE
https://youtu.be/GJsHgvlC6Xg

[Mic]

You can write program in Python

https://youtu.be/Al3D9U9-glU

[StephenG1CMZ]

If you have two Android phones (one running 8151 and one current) sharing the same Google name, would there be any risk of "synchronisation" affecting the other device?
I'm planning to update the phone with 8151, if I can free up a few MB.

If so, I have access to a different Google name that I could use.

[webmasterpdx]

(11-11-2017 04:24 PM)Arno K Wrote:  

(11-11-2017 12:26 PM)webmasterpdx Wrote:  Possible bugs in graph3d.

First, the Autoscale zoom option seems to always give the ! reply.

Second....

If you try to plot a half a sphere using:

FZ1=sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2))

This should be a sphere of radius 4. You'll notice these extreme jaggies as it gets close to the plane z=0. At first, I thought it might just be rounding errors, but if you use a radius of 10, you can see the blank areas are much taller in the z direction than 1, which means it's not rounding error. It should be flush with the plane z=0.

Try plotting the following:

FZ1=sqrt(16-(X^2+Y^2))

FZ2=0

That'll plot the semi-sphere and the plane, which gives the following (the semi-sphere should be flush with the plane)...

Perhaps that has to do with the TRIANGLE command, but Wofram Alpha doesn't do much better. for that reason I requested a parametric-3d plot some time ago.
Arno

Actually, wolfram alpha does do it better. However, you can see the jaggies in wolfram as it looks like it draws it and then fills in the jaggie gaps without shading, so you see them as a lighter shade.

[Arno K]

(11-11-2017 10:59 PM)webmasterpdx Wrote:  

(11-11-2017 04:24 PM)Arno K Wrote:  Perhaps that has to do with the TRIANGLE command, but Wofram Alpha doesn't do much better. for that reason I requested a parametric-3d plot some time ago.
Arno

Actually, wolfram alpha does do it better. However, you can see the jaggies in wolfram as it looks like it draws it and then fills in the jaggie gaps without shading, so you see them as a lighter shade.

I said that it did "not much" better...

[Carlos295pz]

(11-11-2017 05:16 PM)Mic Wrote:  You can write program in Python
https://youtu.be/Al3D9U9-glU

For now it is implemented scantly, if the calculator is directed to implement several languages it would be excellent, many hope to protect their programs

[AlexFekken]

(11-11-2017 04:33 PM)Anders Wrote:  It also does not matter if you change the Num X Step and NUM Y Step to something smaller say 0.0000001 because that is in the Graph 3D Num Set Up screens.

Like I mentioned in the "How to specify +/- in a function definition." thread where this was first discussed, you can get a better result by increasing the Grid size in the Setup. Unfortunately this is currently limited to 100x100, so at this stage it may be more productive to request an increase in the max grid size, rather than the implementation of what would be an entrirely different algorithm.

Just my 2c.

[Archanus]

Hey Tim

The changelog of the new version say:

""7. Internal color has been reworked to use 32 bit color. This means images as backgrounds will look nicer and gradients will look nicer. Programmer will appreciated the rework to make sure all ALPHA information for drawing commands behaves consistently."""

But bro, I sincerely don't see any screen changes in the HP Prime (calculator, not Emulator)

[AlexFekken]

(11-11-2017 05:07 PM)Mic Wrote:  2 small videos showing 3D graphing and tabvar use in action

Thanks for pointing out tabvar...

[webmasterpdx]

(11-12-2017 04:50 AM)AlexFekken Wrote:  

(11-11-2017 04:33 PM)Anders Wrote:  It also does not matter if you change the Num X Step and NUM Y Step to something smaller say 0.0000001 because that is in the Graph 3D Num Set Up screens.

Like I mentioned in the "How to specify +/- in a function definition." thread where this was first discussed, you can get a better result by increasing the Grid size in the Setup. Unfortunately this is currently limited to 100x100, so at this stage it may be more productive to request an increase in the max grid size, rather than the implementation of what would be an entrirely different algorithm.

Just my 2c.

Yes, increasing the grid size to 100x100 does improve it. I'd like to request yall allow it to go to 1000x1000.....as with the current algorithm, it can't do a semisphere with 100x100....

[Mic]

Most enhancements in a video : https://youtu.be/NjZwKW78D_M

[ggauny@live.fr]

Thanks misters Parisse and mic !

[ggauny@live.fr]

The same most beautifull.

[Tyann]

Bonjour
Je viens de faire les mise à jour et n'ai eu aucun problème.
Hp a répondu à l'attente de nombreux utilisateurs : avec les 2 nouvelles fonctions du tableur qui permettent de vider une cellule et de tester si celle-ci est vide ou pas.
Suppress et Insert était attendues aussi je crois et c'est bien.
Par contre je trouve dommage la limitation à un seul caractère pour Insert sur les chaînes de caractères.
Le fait de pouvoir inhiber des touches en mode User avec Return -1 me semble une excellente idée pour les applications personnelles.
Par contre il serait bien de pouvoir basculer en mode User par programme et tester le mode en cours.
Concernant les fonctions et programmes utilisateurs dans le catalogue, il serait peut-être bon de pouvoir choisir ceux que l'on veut inserer avec un CEXPORT par exemple.
Sinon le nouveau catalogue et celui des variables sont vraiment très pratiques .
Je réitére mes remerciements à toute l'équipe de développement qui a fait de l'excellent travail et qui me permet de passer de sacrés bon moments avec cette superbe calculatrice qu'est la Hp Prime.

Hello
I just upgraded and had no problem.
Hp has responded to the expectations of many users: with the 2 new functions of the spreadsheet that allow to empty a cell and test if it is empty or not.
Suppress and Insert was expected too, I believe and that's good.
By cons I find damage the limitation to a single character for Insert on strings.
Being able to inhibit keys in User mode with Return -1 seems to me a great idea for personal applications.
On the other hand it would be nice to be able to switch to User mode programmatically and test the current mode.
Regarding the functions and user programs in the catalog, it might be good to be able to choose those that you want to insert with a CEXPORT for example.
Otherwise the new catalog and the variable's catalogue are really handy.
I reiterate my thanks to all the development team who did a great job and allows me to spend some good time with this great calculator that is the Hp Prime.