HP35 origin

06162018, 10:58 PM
(This post was last modified: 06182018 08:18 PM by hibiki.)
Post: #1




HP35 origin
http://codex99.com/design/thehp35.html
I found this site about the HP 35 history. I know that there are a lot of pages about the same matter and sorry if it was already posted here. I did not know how HP priced its products: the cost multiplied by a factor of "PI" or "e", that was curious to me. For those who do not know the page, it´s very cool. My calcs: HP12C, HP15C, HP17BII+, HP20S, HP20B, HP32SII, HP34C, HP35S, HP42S, HP48GX. 

06172018, 05:56 PM
Post: #2




RE: HP35 origin
This is an interesting blog. There are some most interesting claims. It would be helpful to have a list of annotated references  particularily from Hewlett, Packard, Cochran [etal] documents.
TomC 

06172018, 06:15 PM
Post: #3




RE: HP35 origin
Great article!
I liked the company standard: selling price is (materials cost) * Pi !!! Kevin 

06172018, 06:57 PM
Post: #4




RE: HP35 origin  
06172018, 08:23 PM
Post: #5




RE: HP35 origin
Very interesting.
Thanks. I found my HP 35 (serial # 1346A.....) at a flea market lost in a bunch of junk. It wanted I owned it because I never give a look to bunches of junk ! And it’s still alive ! My site http://www.emmella.fr 

06182018, 12:02 AM
Post: #6




RE: HP35 origin
(06172018 06:15 PM)mcquiggi Wrote: Great article! If I took that phrase literally (Pi !!!), HP50G calculates that to be 9.99999999999 E499. Somehow, I think even HP wouldn't be that crazy. Pi !! came to about 7380.55555766, and Pi! comes to 7.1881ish, or so my HP34C told me back in the day. That might be closer to the scale that HP was originally thinking of. (Post 244) Regards, BrickViking HP50g Casio fx9750G+ Casio fx9750GII (SH4a) 

06182018, 12:36 AM
Post: #7




RE: HP35 origin
(06182018 12:02 AM)brickviking Wrote:(06172018 06:15 PM)mcquiggi Wrote: Great article! Ha! I anticipated this interpretation so I put a space between Pi and the ‘!!!’ part! Perhaps Pi!!! Was the government price! Kevin 

06182018, 07:47 PM
Post: #8




RE: HP35 origin
(06182018 12:02 AM)brickviking Wrote:(06172018 06:15 PM)mcquiggi Wrote: Great article! When did Pi become a natural number? Factorial is only defined for natural numbers. 

06182018, 10:27 PM
Post: #9




RE: HP35 origin
(06162018 10:58 PM)hibiki Wrote: http://codex99.com/design/thehp35.html Indeed it is. Thank you very much, I've found it really interesting and an excellent read. Would love to find something similar about the HP65. V. . All My Articles & other Materials here: Valentin Albillo's HP Collection 

06182018, 11:05 PM
Post: #10




RE: HP35 origin
(06182018 07:47 PM)Harald Wrote:(06182018 12:02 AM)brickviking Wrote: If I took that phrase literally (Pi !!!), HP50G calculates that to be 9.99999999999 E499. Somehow, I think even HP wouldn't be that crazy. Pi !! came to about 7380.55555766, and Pi! comes to 7.1881ish, or so my HP34C told me back in the day. That might be closer to the scale that HP was originally thinking of. While that's true, certain factorial implementations (hp34c, HP48series, HP50G and others) interpolate noninteger results by using the Gamma function, as the factorial function is merely the integerbased special case of the Gamma function. Pretty much: \( n! = Γ(n+1) \), if I remember rightly, and I'm sorry if I can't get that Gamma to come out correctly. I had fun trying to generate the inverse... of course that's not defined anywhere mathematically, so I was told. (Post 245) Regards, BrickViking HP50g Casio fx9750G+ Casio fx9750GII (SH4a) 

06192018, 01:26 AM
Post: #11




RE: HP35 origin
(06182018 10:27 PM)Valentin Albillo Wrote: Indeed it is. Thank you very much, I've found it really interesting and an excellent read. Would love to find something similar about the HP65. A few more links: http://www.hpl.hp.com/hpjournal/pdfs/Iss...97405.pdf http://hpmemoryproject.org/wb_pages/wall_b_page_11b.htm http://hpmemoryproject.org/wb_pages/j_minck_01.htm https://www.hpe.com/us/en/insights/artic...1709.html 

06192018, 05:29 AM
(This post was last modified: 06192018 06:59 AM by Didier Lachieze.)
Post: #12




RE: HP35 origin
@hibiki, thanks for the link. I knew about this site but this article has been updated in May 2018 with much more detailed information than previously.
Edit: here is the link to the original article from 2012. 

06192018, 07:40 AM
Post: #13




RE: HP35 origin
The middle section of this video is about the HP35  "Death of the Slide Rule"
See also this archived site, presenting an article from 1972 Made in USA...finally! 

06192018, 08:15 AM
Post: #14




RE: HP35 origin
(06182018 11:05 PM)brickviking Wrote: Pretty much: \( n! = Γ(n+1) \), if I remember rightly, and I'm sorry if I can't get that Gamma to come out correctly. I had fun trying to generate the inverse... of course that's not defined anywhere mathematically, so I was told. Do you mean something like that? I prefer Inverse Factorial, however: 120 XEQ InvFact > 5 PI SQRT 3 * 4 / XEQ InvFact > 1.5 163 ENTER ENTER + 1/x + ENTER * 5 * 18 / XEQ InvFact XEQ InvFact > 3.14159265359 (On Free42) 00 { 89Byte Prgm } 01▸LBL "InvFact" 02 ENTER 03 LN 04 SQRT 05 0.16 06 RCL× ST L 07 X<>Y 08 2.21 09 × 10 + 11 0.194 12 + 13 2 14 X<Y? 15 X<>Y 16 X<> ST T 17▸LBL 00 18 R↓ 19 R↓ 20 STO ST Z 21 X<>Y 22 STO ST T 23 GAMMA 24 ÷ 25 +/ 26 1 27 + 28 R↑ 29 RCL+ ST T 30 1/X 31 RCL ST T 32 LN 33 STO ST Y 34 X<> ST L 35 R↓ 36 +/ 37 ÷ 38 STO ST Z 39 ABS 40 1ᴇ30 41 X<Y? 42 GTO 00 43 R↑ 44 1 45  46 END 

06192018, 10:22 AM
Post: #15




RE: HP35 origin
(06182018 12:02 AM)brickviking Wrote:(06172018 06:15 PM)mcquiggi Wrote: Great article! I am curious  How did you parse that expression? X!! Is not the same as (X!)! If you have heard of doublefactorials, although of course it is if you haven't, ! Being an ambiguous mathematical symbol. Is that x!!! (A triple factorial?) (X!!)! (Factorial of a double factorial) (X!)!! (Double factorial of a factorial) ((X!)!)! (Factorial of a factorial of a factorial) Stephen Lewkowicz (G1CMZ) https://my.numworks.com/python/steveg1cmz 

06192018, 11:09 AM
Post: #16




RE: HP35 origin
(06192018 10:22 AM)StephenG1CMZ Wrote:(06182018 12:02 AM)brickviking Wrote: Pi !!! I'd vote for the triple factorial interpretation. Although I noticed that Wolfram Alpha interprets it as (Pi !!)! instead, so it recognizes the double factorial but not higherorder multifactorials. Also interesting is that it appears to have an analytic continuation of the double factorial; I wonder if such continuations exist for higherorder multifactorials as well? 

06202018, 07:31 PM
Post: #17




RE: HP35 origin
(06192018 10:22 AM)StephenG1CMZ Wrote:(06182018 12:02 AM)brickviking Wrote: If I took that phrase literally (Pi !!!), HP50G calculates that to be 9.99999999999 E499. Somehow, I think even HP wouldn't be that crazy. Pi !! came to about 7380.55555766, and Pi! comes to 7.1881ish, or so my HP34C told me back in the day. That might be closer to the scale that HP was originally thinking of. I parsed that as the following procedure would indicate: \((((\pi!)!)!)\), therefore would have approximately been: \(\pi! = 7.18808272898\) \(7.18808272898! = 7380.55555766 \) \(7380.55555766! = OVERFLOW \)(at least for my 50G) And I'd have to check what on earth are doublefactorials or triplefactorials. I haven't heard of such a beast. (Later) Oh, so that's what those are. Interesting. (Post 246) Regards, BrickViking HP50g Casio fx9750G+ Casio fx9750GII (SH4a) 

12062018, 01:29 PM
Post: #18




RE: HP35 origin
(06162018 10:58 PM)hibiki Wrote: http://codex99.com/design/thehp35.html On a journey to get the story about HP35 and forward until the TITAN with the SATURN, i noticed your links in this stream. The PI was once explained to me like this 1/3 for Components and MFG 1/3 for Cost of Sales / Admin 1/3 for Profits 

12102018, 02:41 AM
(This post was last modified: 12102018 03:09 AM by Gerson W. Barbosa.)
Post: #19




RE: HP35 origin
(06202018 07:31 PM)brickviking Wrote: I parsed that as the following procedure would indicate: That’s a job for superwp34s: pi ! ! 1 + LNgamma 10 LN / IP RCL L FP 10^x —> 4.41316713166 x<>y —> 25345 => ((pi!)!)! = 4.41316713166*10^25345 or, approximately, 490347/111110*10^25345 Notice that (pi!)! ~ 66425/9 is much nicer. PS: LOGGAMMA on the HP 50g gives a less accurate mantissa: 4.4131694182 

12102018, 04:00 AM
Post: #20




RE: HP35 origin
(06182018 07:47 PM)Harald Wrote:(06182018 12:02 AM)brickviking Wrote: If I took that phrase literally (Pi !!!), HP50G calculates that to be 9.99999999999 E499. Somehow, I think even HP wouldn't be that crazy. Pi !! came to about 7380.55555766, and Pi! comes to 7.1881ish, or so my HP34C told me back in the day. That might be closer to the scale that HP was originally thinking of. The Gamma function is defined for reals (and complex numbers). It agrees with the factorial on the positive integers. 

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